Repeating Level 4?

[Shawn]

I am seeing a lot of talk about first and second years at L4 and it seems like a lot of girls do L4 more than once. As my DD is just moving up to L4, I'm curious about this. Are we talking about AAU or USAG L4? How common is it to repeat L4? Why do they repeat? Are there certain skills that give the girls trouble? How many years did everyone's DDs do L4 and, if more than one, why?

[Gymmonkeymomma]

At our gym, the coaches' goal is to get girls to move up (sometimes more quickly than necessary, IMHO). Last year, on my DD's team there were 10 girls at USAG Level 4. DD was the youngest at 6. At the end of the summer, the coaches were toying with the idea of keeping DD at Level 4 "because she is so young"...while ALL of her teammates moved up (the rest of the girls were 9-13 yrs old).....even though she had almost all of her skills (except the squat on/jump to high bar) and some of the other girls didn't even have their kips! I had a talk with the coach and expressed to him that if the only reason is because of her age, I didn't think that was right to keep her back and torture her with having to do another year of the mill circle, not to mention what it might do to her self esteem. She ended up moving up to Level 5 along with the other girls and is holding her own (except for the jump, which she is working on). There is a rumor that no one in our gym is moving up this year.

My older DD only did 1 year of Level 4 - she turned 8 at her first meet. She was an "ok" Level 4- scoring 33-34's. Her team only competed 2 meets, but then they did USAIGC with the same routines (that was when USAIGC allowed the USAG compulsory routines, no more). The following year, she did Level 5 and came in 6th AA at States.

[M23K's]

My daughter did her first year of level 4 at 7 years old. They moved her to level 5 when she was 8 but she struggled. She had the skills for 5 but she didn't want to put in the hard work so we decided to let her do level 4 again. I think the main problem was an abusive coach. I think under no circumstances a child should be treated badly. I know it's commonly accepted as being 'just the way things are in gymnastics' but it's wrong. The coach talked to her horribly. I think she was trying to motivate her but it didn't work. A ton of people have left our old gym this past year due to many, many cases of nasty coach syndrome.

Sorry....I went on a rant but I haven't completely let go of my anger towards her old coach.

I think some kids are held back because they haven't mastered the basics of 4 but then some kids have all their level 4 skills down pat but can't seem to get the skills for 5. Some gyms also have kids compete 2 years at the same level so the gym places well at meets.

[flippymonkeysmom]

I think it depends on age, how well they did and whether they have the skills to move up. My dd competed level 4 when she was 8 and only did one year of it. Level 5 I thought she was going to have to repeat, but right before the start of the season everything clicked and she moved to level 6. I generally don't get involved - I leave it up to her and her coaches. If it were up to me I would have left her at 5 - I didn't think she was ready for 6 - but then she ended up doing really well - so I guess the coaches knew what they are talking about.

[Blackie6]

My DD did her first year at USAG L4 as a 6 yr old. She just learned most of the skills about 2 (Feb-June was TOPS training) months before meet season (Sept-Jan in NJ) and learned the routines themselves about a month before. Even though she was on pre-team for a year, the only "skill" they worked on there were pull-overs, walk-overs, handstands & vault. That's why I am jealous of those of you with L2 and L3 teams working on skills and meet experience! More than 1/2 my DD's team moved up to L5 after states, but that is a whole other story. Some of them are second year L4's without the benefit of a meet season their 1st year because our gym's L4-6 teams are in the re-building process. Most of them did score very well but they were also older than my DD, mostly 8-10's . The youngest girls on our L4 team are doing a second year. My DD just turned 7 (competed states as a 6 yr old) and now that she has the skills, the routines and the meet experience I think doing L4 again is a good idea. Plus the hours go from 10.5 to 16, which would be a huge jump for my DD who does other activities. Our gym does not have rules about how many years at each level or what scores are. Move-ups are based on the individual. But even some that could have gone to L5 decided to repeat to spend time on the "basics".

I know your DD is doing the L3 which is great, so maybe you won't worry about the repeat year, but I felt my DD got thrown in suddenly and played "catch-up" the first year learning skills, routines, & getting comfortable at meets.

My DD will probably do a double season which is the L4 into the L5 season. So she will be a 2nd yr L4 @7 and then be a 1st yr L5 as an young 8. By then maybe she will know if she wants to be in the gym 16 hrs/week. I believe that most of the new L5's will be repeating as well. L5 seems to be a big repeat year from what I've been reading. But, we are trying not to get ahead of ourselves with the plan, LOL

[melmonette]

Emily was 6 when she moved to level 4 and just turned 7 by her first meet(She has an August 99 birthday). Last year, Emily had all the skills but she was sloppy and didn't score super great. Her best all around score last year was 33.85 in which her highest event scores were 8.9 on Vault, 8.3 on bars, 8.5 on beam and 8.725 on Floor Ex. Well our gym had a strict rule. You don't score a 35 in the AA once in the season... You are not invited to train level 5 after the season is over. Emily had to repeat level 4 even though by fall she had her kips and all the level 5 skills even before some of the girls who got to move up and stay in level 5. It was a good thing for Emily though because she has gotten to do well this year and work her level 5 skills throughout this year and she has really improved with presentation. Emily just finally learned to perform essentially. Her coach last year says it was an age thing and some kids get it early than others do but eventually it clicks.

[Shawn]

Actually, my DD has decided to skip up to L4 instead of spending the year at L3. And I think she is totally ready. She already has her cast squat on and long-hang pullover. In fact, the only AAU L4 bars skill she needs is the front hip circle. The vault is basically the same. On floor she just needs the BHS and on beam she needs the cartwheel and the side handstand w/ 1/4 turn dismount. They don't compete until next January and she is close to having all of these skills so I think she's going to do just fine. As a L2, her lowest AA score has been 34.9 and her average is 36 (she's gotten two high 35s, one 36 and one 37).

I'm not sure what the new gym's policy is about moving up (as far as AA scores, etc.). But, as she's just starting L4, I'm not ready to worry about that yet. I'm just curious because there are so many repeats.

[fruitcake]

The last few years roughly half our level 4's have repeated and the other move on up. There is no set score to move up--it is based on what the coaches think is best for each girl. Every now and then we have a girl chose to repeat because they or their family aren't ready for the jump in hours/commitment. Our coaches try to be sure the girls are at a level where they will succeed--ie not just do the skills but actually get to place at meets. My dd repeated level 4 and 5--could have moved up after one year both times but would not have scored well and I know that would have bothered her. I would rather my dd feels good then just move through the levels.

[gymjourneymom]

I agree with fruitcake! It's more important for the girls to have a sense of achievement instead of them just getting thru the levels. If it takes a gymnast 2 yrs at a level the achieve this... so be it...1 year to learn the skills...1 year to master & perfect them. There's always room for improvement in a skill & there's always up training going on to keep the interest up. The gymnast should be working & enjoying herself

[lannamavity]

Quote:
Originally Posted by gymjourneymom I agree with fruitcake! It's more important for the girls to have a sense of achievement instead of them just getting thru the levels. If it takes a gymnast 2 yrs at a level the achieve this... so be it...1 year to learn the skills...1 year to master & perfect them. There's always room for improvement in a skill & there's always up training going on to keep the interest up. The gymnast should be working & enjoying herself

That's a great way to look at it.

The great benefit to Level 4 is that the gymnast learns all of the formalities/procedures at a meet (saluting, warming up, etc), and the benefits of good, consistent workouts before they have more complicated routines to be concerned with.

Strong Level 4's (either first or second year) always make for confident, polished Level 5's and 6's.

I have also seen 3rd year Level 4's or 5's zip through to optionals once they have matured to the point where things "click".