WAG Elite Gym Contracts

[Natalia]

A national team member was on the 2012 olympic team.Her 2 years duty were up with her old club,she wanted to change her liscence to another club while she trained at the national center.

Her old club dragged their feet doing the paper work.

After a massive confrontation between the girl the parents and the club, the old club laid down the rules of the game "You want to go to the olympic games ?You will go as a member of our club or you won't go at all"

She nearly missed the games.

 

[Natalia]

I have to type various post or I get timed out.

DD started her year with 8 girls in her group.Only 1 is still at the club, 6 girls quit.Mine managed to hag on to the end o the competitive season so that her contract was up.

6 girls who loved gymnastics,hated being yelled at,hit,called fat....could not hold on.They quit.
The club is perfectly happy with this,if a girl brakes under their training she quits and cannot thrive elsewhere,putting their abuse to shame.

Some of you might remember my story of finding her old coach in front of my house threatening to have my kid bullied at school if we "defected"

.....So,yeah,free market economies are cruel,but they're the best we've got.

 

[bookworm]

United European Socialist Republics welcomes Jimbound.

Here the FFG (French gym federation)will regulate the thickness of the toilet paper used in your gym.

Girls belong to their clubs,they may only leave with the consent of their coaches and the new club has to buy the girls liscence from the old club.If the old club says no,the girl can quit or stay and suffer.

And suffer she will.The old club has a wannabe traitor,they will destroy her physically and mentaly,so that ,when the contract ends and the girl is finaly free, the old club has ensured that she is nothing more then damaged goods.

Glad we don't live there....

 

[Natalia]

Most coaches are great,but when an ambitious driven egomaniac plays the system it's catastrophic

 

[BachFlyer]

Natalia, i remember your story, it made me cringe in the worst way! This sounds like a worst case scenario, but definitely would keep me from signing up for this sport in your country! Did your daughter end up finding a different place to train? I sure hope so!

 

[BachFlyer]

I understand that some people are gym hoppers and the losing gym might have put a lot of hard work into her, but that's just life. Our kids are NOT commodities! They should not be bought, sold or traded under contract. This applies to rec kids or elites, any one who is not a legal adult. It sets the kids up for ongoing abuse, which is hard enough to deal with when you CAN leave, let alone when you CAN'T.

 

[Jimbound]

The governing body which regulates gym membership may serve as a police force of sorts. If ten students who are registered with the governing body which oversees membership gym-hop out of your gym in the same month and it keeps happening time and again then the Gymnastics Membership Police will take notice and address the shortcomings of your program. There will never be a gym that is not up to speed as long as the governing body exists which oversees the standards set up by the other governing body called USA Gymnastics. We have no police. We need it. To control gym-hopping and assess fees. To police teaching standards. To assure every gym is granted an agency status toward every competitive gymnast who may one day win a windfall through professional interests. Please note that the absence of these methods in American Gymnastics does not mean these ideas are radical just because we are not using them. On the contrary. We are being negligent by not forcing gyms to maintain the standards which have been set by USA Gymnastics. We are negligent by allowing gym hoppers to abandon a program where the staff has invested years of service and years of promise in good faith without any compensation when they leave.

 

[AmandaLynn]

Are you serious?? We don't even have enough coaching staff in most gyms in the country! Many states are in a constant of begging people to take the judging exams so that they can fill the demand for judges for the meets on their calendars. And you are proposing that we need to add yet another position in this country's gymnastics world that we don't have enough knowledgable people to fill?!? Do you even comprehend how impossible of a task it would be to "police" every single club in the country? How many staff members that would take? How much money it would cost??

You are off your rocker.

 

[gymdog]

The governing body which regulates gym membership may serve as a police force of sorts. If ten students who are registered with the governing body which oversees membership gym-hop out of your gym in the same month and it keeps happening time and again then the Gymnastics Membership Police will take notice and address the shortcomings of your program. There will never be a gym that is not up to speed as long as the governing body exists which oversees the standards set up by the other governing body called USA Gymnastics. We have no police. We need it. To control gym-hopping and assess fees. To police teaching standards. To assure every gym is granted an agency status toward every competitive gymnast who may one day win a windfall through professional interests. Please note that the absence of these methods in American Gymnastics does not mean these ideas are radical just because we are not using them. On the contrary. We are being negligent by not forcing gyms to maintain the standards which have been set by USA Gymnastics. We are negligent by allowing gym hoppers to abandon a program where the staff has invested years of service and years of promise in good faith without any compensation when they leave.

You say "we" but your country says Colombia. Are you American?

 

[z2akids]

The governing body which regulates gym membership may serve as a police force of sorts. If ten students who are registered with the governing body which oversees membership gym-hop out of your gym in the same month and it keeps happening time and again then the Gymnastics Membership Police will take notice and address the shortcomings of your program. There will never be a gym that is not up to speed as long as the governing body exists which oversees the standards set up by the other governing body called USA Gymnastics. We have no police. We need it. To control gym-hopping and assess fees. To police teaching standards. To assure every gym is granted an agency status toward every competitive gymnast who may one day win a windfall through professional interests. Please note that the absence of these methods in American Gymnastics does not mean these ideas are radical just because we are not using them. On the contrary. We are being negligent by not forcing gyms to maintain the standards which have been set by USA Gymnastics. We are negligent by allowing gym hoppers to abandon a program where the staff has invested years of service and years of promise in good faith without any compensation when they leave.

I don't know of any gym that takes their students on a contingent basis. They all are paid fees - monthly, coaches fees, membership fees, meet fees, etc. etc. etc. They are compensated (some more than others) for the years of training. Gymnastics is not a sport in which large monetary rewards are common, except for a very select few. Gyms and coaches have the potential to increase their income by association with well known/high level gymnasts. New students come to gyms that have shown success.

I suppose if a gym wanted to, they could take their students on a contingent basis and train them for free with a vested interest in any earnings they may have. I highly doubt that there are many gyms that could afford to take that chance. But in the US, there is no expectation that every coach that is involved in the development of an athlete is going to get a portion of their windfall at some point. My DH has coached a 5 year old flag football players and has gone on to make millions of dollars in the NFL. No, portion of his income came our way.

 

[bookworm]

You are off your rocker.

Bingo!

 

[Jimbound]

Exemplary gyms with model programs do not prevent gym hopping. Many great coaches and great gymnasts from great gyms throughout history have absconded to other gyms in order to satisfy competing interests via gym hopping. The only acceptable answer from the people hanging around this chalk bucket is that if those great gyms improve their programs and get better instructors then all will be well. What is wrong with this present day collective of experts who want to pretend problems do not exist and that those problems are not important? I will tell you. They have no answers and don't like the medicine which will cure the maladies.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

Clients do not always leave based on personal preferences. Sometimes it is one gym encroaching or stealing coaches, instructors, class members, etc., from other gyms by enticing them in both scrupulous and unscrupulous manners. Sometimes money is used to induce other gym members to transfer. This can happen at competitions, grocery stores, public and private academic schools, etc. A contract may attempt to circumvent the loss of investment a gym makes to win and keep clientele both students and staff. However, a better way would be to simply regulate gyms so that gym hopping is controlled and mitigated. If a contract as suggested by this thread is plausible then regulation is also feasible being a more organized and standardized method. A gym should always be compensated when someone defaults to another provider. Do you not understand that a lost customer or employee translates into lost revenue and investment? Something needs to be done about it. Contracts at will is at best a barnyard free-for-all when individual gyms decide on their own how to draw up a contract. Instead it should be regulated and controlled. No gym should suffer a total loss but the method and parameters should be spelled out. Just saying.

what you are suggesting is that gyms would be under Government Control & Regulation. over my dead body...

 

[Deleted member D3987]

In a regulated world the parent element is taken out of the loop. Likewise so is the gym owner and the gymnast and the coach and the instructor, and clerical staff, etc., taken out of the loop. The governing body determines parameters and USA Gymnastics backs them up. In other words if you are a new student taking a class at xyz gym and suddenly after a month you wish to opt for the gym across town then the receiving gym or the student would have to pay a certain remuneration to the loosing party. This would in effect mitigate and control the nemesis of gym hopping. Across the board as stipulated by the governing body and backed by USA Gymnastics there would be a fee schedule set up for all contingencies including exceptions and sliding scales. Gyms which sign up for the program under the governing body under the auspices of USA Gymnastics would agree to abide by formatted parameters over which no one has a say. You simply follow the law as written. A one year coach is worth lets say $1000 at level 1. $2000 at level 2, and so on. If you are a ten year elite level coach as defined by the governing body then you may be worth $50,ooo to the losing party. Tit for tat. No discussions. Do not pass go. It's simply a fee that controls and regulates gym hopping. If anyone has a better idea other than pandering to the old sentiment of demanding better quality from the gym which has never mitigated or addressed this issue head on, then please expound. Gym hopping is a huge problem and contracts are private attempts to deal with it. There has to be a better way. There is. Regulation.

they gots some good Hopium down where you are at, eh?

 

[Deleted member D3987]

This is one of the more unusual conversations that I have ever read on this board. The idea of regulating in this manner is anti- everything that we stand for in the area of a free society with freedom of choice.

i just want to know what's in his kool aid...

 

[Deleted member D3987]

The governing body which regulates gym membership may serve as a police force of sorts. If ten students who are registered with the governing body which oversees membership gym-hop out of your gym in the same month and it keeps happening time and again then the Gymnastics Membership Police will take notice and address the shortcomings of your program. There will never be a gym that is not up to speed as long as the governing body exists which oversees the standards set up by the other governing body called USA Gymnastics. We have no police. We need it. To control gym-hopping and assess fees. To police teaching standards. To assure every gym is granted an agency status toward every competitive gymnast who may one day win a windfall through professional interests. Please note that the absence of these methods in American Gymnastics does not mean these ideas are radical just because we are not using them. On the contrary. We are being negligent by not forcing gyms to maintain the standards which have been set by USA Gymnastics. We are negligent by allowing gym hoppers to abandon a program where the staff has invested years of service and years of promise in good faith without any compensation when they leave.

ok, i was wrong. it's something stronger that Hopium...

and i want you all to understand this. AND CLICK TO EXPAND TO SEE HIS BS IN RED FONT. there are NO STANDARDS ANYWHERE LAID DOWN OR SET BY USA GYMNASTICS THAT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO AT ALL WITH THIS SUBJECT MATTER. AGAIN, ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF SOMEONE USING THEIR NAME AND MAKING BS UP ABOUT OUR NGB.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

hey, Mods. maybe you let this guy know he'll be banned when he makes up **** about USA Gymnastics. that's an absolute no no in my book.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

You say "we" but your country says Colombia. Are you American?

yes, he's American...but smoking Colombian. and i think me may be Stretch's twin.

 

[Jimbound]

Wow! I dunno who this dunno is but it is a sad testimony let this guy insinuate that the AAU, then the USGF, followed by USA Gymnastics has evolved to have no standards to which they hold students, and officials, and coaches to live up to. I was there in the 70's advocating the idea of safety certification, stretch books, conditioning books, and all kinds of literature that would add more depth to the academics of gymnastics which was lacking. I even advocated that authors write living biographies of gymnastics personages in order to preserve a record of all the hard work being sacrificed by so many top level officials, and coaches who were changing and improving the way business was run. I was also for private school organizations and coaches organizations such as elite coaches organizations. Everyone thought I was crazy. I advocated that we develop a formal school atmosphere where the teaching of gymnastics principles went beyond the state meetings and annual congress. They thought I was crazy for suggesting that there ought to be colleges dedicated to a core curriculum of gymnastics. Colleges centered around a gymnastics based sports program yet you would also receive a well rounded education and degrees related to specialized expertise in gymnastics. Yes, a gymnastics college. Only now is the governing body actually implementing the concept of formal schooling based on standards dunno implies do not exist. I dunno how and why dunno would come into this thread and insinuate that the history of gymnastics and it present day status under the auspices of the existing governing body is a barnyard free-for-all. It is certainly not the case. If the moderators wish to extricate me for speaking in favor of progress and the history of progress then so be it. It would prove that kind kindles kind. Contracts are in many cases an attempt to control gym hopping or early withdrawal. I acknowledge that gym hopping exists and that it is a pernicious problem. I have offered tangible ideas which might help remedy the situation. The wrong thing to do is pretend that it will go away. If it happens to your gym then according to the consensus in this thread you will need to improve your program, improve your coaching, and retrain your employees so that students and staff will not even think of leaving if you can believe this nonsense. Gym hopping happens to the best of gyms at the highest levels. So much for that theory. I dunno why dunno used my reference to the non-existent governing body which does not exist to make his false accusation. I was talking about the governing body which does exist. However, I advocate that we should initiate and develop another governing body to work in conjunction with the existing governing body. Maybe dunno doesn't understand what he reads? Hey dunno, there is no governing body that regulates gym membership to control gym hopping. If anyone should be extricated it's someone like dunno who misquotes someone and then uses that quote to make up a false testimony with immature language such as Hopium. Until now I was not picking on anyone but this tort against me is personal by dunno and a few others who are in my opinion shortsighted. I was not addressing anyone or picking on anyone. I was simply stating my ideas and opinions and truth as I understand it. I did not get personal with anyone until now since they started it. Hopium? Are you 10? 13 at the most.

 

[bogwoppit]

hey, Mods. maybe you let this guy know he'll be banned when he makes up **** about USA Gymnastics. that's an absolute no no in my book.

Not breaking any rules. But sure is amusing the heck out of me. I am watching though.