Bar help for Club

[gym monkeys mom]

I orginally posted this in the parent froum but i would like parents and coach opinions.This is a tough post for me but, here it goes anyways. My dd has been with her club since she started on team she is currently a L7 doing well except for bars. Our club is owned by 2 brothers one takes care of the boys program one the girls. Our boys program is strong and sucessful. Our girls do fine but, we have problems retaining upper level girls and coaches. I really believe in the owners and thier philosophy about gymnastics. However, our girls team is having problems at most levels with bars this is the area one of the owners coaches. Any suggestions about how to approach the owners about the need to have additional coaching help on bars (ie: the other owner coach for awhile). I realize it would be easier to walk away and find a new club. I however, dont feel like that is the answer. We also are having a problem attractiong another qualified girls team coach. Please help my daughter loves her club and we just would like to see it thrive. We recently in our area have had 3 new clubs open.

[gmom46]

I hope you get an answer, because quite frankly our team is weakest on bars all the way across the board at all levels. My dd is a Level 8 and still struggles w/giants and has not been taught release moves, etc. etc. I would love to have a great bars coach. Our coaches are good, but something must be missing if none of our girls, at any level, really have strong bar skills.

I will be interested to see who replies to you with some suggestions. Perhaps I can use them too! Good luck!

[Scout's Mom]

That's a tough one! It's not unusual to see a gym be weak on one event. The question is: Do the owners see it and want to correct it?

We lived this one--our previous gym was very weak on bars. The head coach always blamed the low scores on the girls, not on coaching. They could slide by through Level 7--but only the most naturally talented gymnasts could master Level 8 bars. No one could ever do Level 9 bars.

My daughter did privates at another gym on the sly for a while. It became obvious that if she wanted to progress, my daughter would have to change gyms.

I'm now kicking myself that I didn't come to this conclusion sooner. My daughter has spent more than a year overcoming bad habits caused by inadequate coaching. As a level 9, she has had to relearn from her kip on up. It has been a real challenge.

All that being said, no gym is perfect; and you could be trading one problem for another......so I completely understand your hesitation to switch.

Good luck!

[gmom46]

Funny...but it almost sounds like our gym! We could slide by with decent level 7 scores, but once in level 8....low score! We only have 3 level 8's, but its rare they are even out the 7's! (my duaghter gets a low 7 at best, and last USAG meet was a 6.8). No giants, no releases, and a weak handstand pirouet (spelling?). Even our girls who DO giants sometimes score less than mine w/o giants (my dd's form is better).

It is frustrating, and it can't be all the girls fault if none of them score well. The coaches need to take some (if not all) responsibility.

[kristilyn73]

Gym Monkey Mom,

tough situation, I wish I had an easy answer.

Do you have one on one meetings with your coaches/owners ever? Have you talked to him? Maybe opening lines of communication they will see that there is a problem. I hve found one the best way to ask my DD's coach, something like that is to start off the conversation:

• "Have you ever thought of....? or .. I am sure you have thought of this but...

I think they may take the idea better that way.

Let me know if it works out! I know you are only trying to help your club!

[lannamavity]

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmom46 Funny...but it almost sounds like our gym! We could slide by with decent level 7 scores, but once in level 8....low score! We only have 3 level 8's, but its rare they are even out the 7's! (my duaghter gets a low 7 at best, and last USAG meet was a 6.8). No giants, no releases, and a weak handstand pirouet (spelling?). Even our girls who DO giants sometimes score less than mine w/o giants (my dd's form is better). It is frustrating, and it can't be all the girls fault if none of them score well. The coaches need to take some (if not all) responsibility.

Sadly, the reason athletes in this situation can't score at Level 8 is because they weren't ready to move to Level 7 in the first place. Clubs with strong bars, almost without exception, require a cast handstand and giants in order to compete Level 7.

I'm sure all involved were so happy and excited to move to Level 7, and now there are consequences.

This is what happens when coaches are "nice" and move kids up before they are ready, instead of letting them become comfortable and sucessful at their current level. Impatient parents like to call that "holding kids back."

A coach can never win. Any complaint now is actually a slap in the coaches' face after moving the kids to Level 7, before they were ready.

Maybe asking the coach for extra bar time, or bar clinics with a judge or National Staff member would be more helpful than just complaining...after all, I'm sure the kids and parents wanted to do Level 8...and now they are Level 8s!

[Gymmonkeymomma]

Quote:
Originally Posted by lannamavity S adly, the reason athletes in this situation can't score at Level 8 is because they weren't ready to move to Level 7 in the first place. Clubs with strong bars, almost without exception, require a cast handstand and giants in order to compete Level 7. ...... Maybe asking the coach for extra bar time, or bar clinics with a judge or National Staff member would be more helpful than just complaining...after all, I'm sure the kids and parents wanted to do Level 8...and now they are Level 8s!

At our club, NONE of the level 7's had cast handstands or giants when they moved up to 7, and only ONE of the current 7's recently started doing giants. Our L8's didn't have them either, when they moved up.

However, I have to disagree with the kids/parents WANTING to move to 8 before they are ready. I know at least one of our 8's did not want to move up and the coach pushed the issue to move her from 7 right into 8 within a month of Level 7 States. I also know that my DD and her 3 L7 teammates all WANT to stay at L7 for at least another year! BTW, asking for bar time (during practice or privates) for over a year has not gotten us anywhere!!!

[Scout's Mom]

Quote:
Originally Posted by lannamavity Sadly, the reason athletes in this situation can't score at Level 8 is because they weren't ready to move to Level 7 in the first place. Clubs with strong bars, almost without exception, require a cast handstand and giants in order to compete Level 7. I'm sure all involved were so happy and excited to move to Level 7, and now there are consequences. This is what happens when coaches are "nice" and move kids up before they are ready, instead of letting them become comfortable and sucessful at their current level. Impatient parents like to call that "holding kids back." A coach can never win. Any complaint now is actually a slap in the coaches' face after moving the kids to Level 7, before they were ready. Maybe asking the coach for extra bar time, or bar clinics with a judge or National Staff member would be more helpful than just complaining...after all, I'm sure the kids and parents wanted to do Level 8...and now they are Level 8s!

This is true--but a little simplistic. Yes, the girls were moved up before they were ready. But why weren't they ready? Most girls who are well coached, well conditioned, and who work hard will have that cast handstand by the time they reach level 7. At our current gym, the cast handstand is worked from Level 4 (not that they "have" it--but it is worked everyday) on up.

So without the proper conditions (whatever they are), a gym ends up with girls who have done X number of years of compulsories and are bored and parents who have paid lots of money and expect progress. Yes, there are those people who are focused on the "Number" and will push the coaches to promote to Level "X". But if the vast majority of gymnasts are weak in a certain area--the coaches really need to see what is not working on their end.

What are other's experiences with this?

[gmom46]

FYI, my dd is a gymnast who was moved from level 7 to level 8 within about 2 weeks of Level 7 states last year (completing only 1 year of level 7). The coach wanted to "see how she would do" at level 8, knowing full well that she did not have all her skills (giants, releases, etc.). For some reason he uses my dd as a "test case." And, it seems, she gets burned a bit for that.

My dd happens (thankfully) to be a gymnast who has natural good form, and thus still scores decently on beam and floor, and can vault pretty good...so only bars is her true weakness. So, she was able (last year) to qualify for sectionals in her first level 8 meet, and did make states in the first sectional...all w/o doing giants.

Please note that I did not request at any time to have my duaghter move up to level 8, nor did she want it. I personally feel it was the biggest mistake in her gymnastic career. She has since become stressed over competing, and getting the required skills. I think she would have made a very good second year Level 7 (if she repeated). Instead, she is a weak 8 (even this year).

I appreciate the response by lannamavity. Being a coach, I'm sure you were looking to give me the coaches point of view. I felt, however, that a reply from me was in order to set the record straight, and see a parents point of view. We are taught (at our gym) not to question the coaches decision. So, I did not think it was my place to quesiton him moving my daughter up a level in the same year. But, what's done is done, and she can't go backwards. She is starting to get her confidence back a little bit, but it is a slow process.

And, another FYI, our coach does not really believe in "private lessons"....so that is virtually not an option. I have also suggested bringing in a bar coach, etc. I say what I can without stepping on toes. But, in response to lannamivity, I don't think the coach was being "nice", nor was I being an impatient parent. Please also note that I don't think her coach was being mean to her. I truly believe he cares about her. He just expects alot from her and perhaps was trying to push her. But, there is a breaking point for children...she was 11 when this all happend, and it just wasn't the right move (for her).

Thanks again for your input. I'm sure there are indeed parents who want their child pushed up, but I am not one of them. And, I'm also sure there are "nice" coaches who just move them up to keep the parents happy. Good luck to them all.

I keep my fingers crossed for my daughters future improvement. I have faith in her that she will perservere.

[ZJsMom]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout's Mom This is true--but a little simplistic. Yes, the girls were moved up before they were ready. But why weren't they ready? Most girls who are well coached, well conditioned, and who work hard will have that cast handstand by the time they reach level 7.

I think Scout's Mom hit the nail on the head here. If one kid's not ready, look at the kid, but if everyone in the gym's not ready you have to look at the coaching and figure out what's missing. If everyone on this team is struggling with one event, which seems to be the case, there does seem to be a need to try something new.

I also think Scout's Mom was right to mention conditioning. This occurred to me too. Bars is really the one event where you'll see lack of conditioning the most. Is it possible that the problem here is insufficient conditioning?