A parent question about BHS/ROBHS drills and private lessons?

[mamaoftwo]

OK, so...

My DD is 8 and a new level 4. She started pre team at the age of 6. She competed one L3 invitational meet this spring (was technically our 'off season') for fun and loved it.

DD is essentially brand new to her gym, again. See, we switched gyms in late fall and based upon original discussions, we thought we'd be there for another year, minimum. Due to staffing issues, DD was moved to their "other gym" about three weeks ago. She's adjusting and getting used to the 'new' coaches. I get it, circumstances change, we're getting through it (but had I known she'd move so soon, we would have placed her in this location from the get-go!).

Anyway, enough background. DD left former gym with some fear issues: handstand on beam and BHS. She seems to have, at long last, conquered the handstand. Apparently, it's easier for her to do it at the end of the beam than in the middle ("If I fall, it'll be onto a mat, not the beam").

But that darned BHS. After one week at the 'new gym', they had DD doing the ROBHS with help of the springboard. After a few decent-looking ones (according to DD, I was not there), they had her do them on the floor. Apparently she turned a dozen or so, some being prettier than others. DD was over the moon.

She still has no standing BHS. She still uses a wedge. Though apparently one coach made her do one on the floor and she completed it, but none have been attempted since. Is this normal? At DD's former gym, there's no way they'd have allowed her to turn a ROBHS if she didn't have a standing BHS first, though I get that all gyms are different.

Of course, within a week, she lost it. In warm-ups (the kids do them unspotted -and uncorrected- during warm-ups), she landed on her head, twice. One of the moms was watching and when I picked up told me about it and said that it looked like DD was just too low, but 'had really fast rotation'. Understandably, DD was then afraid to try again on her own.

In practice, they're having her do them using the springboard again. DD says it's awkward and that she actually would feel more comfortable doing them on the floor, if she had a spot. Says that she doesn't feel like she always hit the springboard with the same amount of force and she gets even more nervous about landing on her head.

DD doesn't feel comfortable saying this to her coaches. She's the type of kid that does what is asked and doesn't ever question authority (even if she does the assigned task through tears).

DD asked to try a private lesson. They're of course all the rage at this gym and the kids talk about them. I agreed and set one up for next week. I figure if nothing else it'll give her some more 1:1 time to get to know/trust her new head coach and give me a chance to have some kind of dialogue with her (the first time I've ever spoken with any of them was when I made the appt). I don't want to make a habit of it, though. They're expensive, and shouldn't regular coaching be enough? Do some kids just need it?

My biggest question is, do I mention this to her coaches (that DD is uncomfortable)? Do I just trust them? Does DD just need more time? Is it the 'new gym'? DD is prone to anxiety and has a tough time expressing it.

I guess after our former experiences I am a little slow to trust - especially as I know nothing about the new coaches.

I get a bit frustrated because I know for a fact some parents in our gym do regular privates it to get their kids ahead based on discussions I've overheard. I hate the thought that in order to have DD be competitive we'd need regular private lessons. Don't get me wrong, I really don't care where DD places, I'm more just complaining that it seems unfair, if that makes sense. And it is, combined with their complaining/bragging, is why I can't stomach watching a practice there.

Thanks for any input and sorry for the long post.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

kids should have a standing flip flop on their own before sequentially progressing to a round>flip flop.

 

[Quadqueen]

While I agree with Dunno in part, in actual practice, many kids don't have a good, clean standing BHS before they have a ROBHS. A standing BHS is harder to do than the momentum they get from ROBHS. They should certainly be working on both, but I would not worry too much if her ROBHS is solid before her standing BHS.

 

[Quadqueen]

in terms of privates, you should not need regular privates just to "keep up." One every once in a while is ok, if they are really struggling with a skill, but I don't see the need to do them regularly. DD has done one private, to work on her kip before L5, in three years of competing...and she practices on the low end of hours that I read are the norm here.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

While I agree with Dunno in part, in actual practice, many kids don't have a good, clean standing BHS before they have a ROBHS. A standing BHS is harder to do than the momentum they get from ROBHS. They should certainly be working on both, but I would not worry too much if her ROBHS is solid before her standing BHS.

in actual practice, there are those of us that will not progress a child until they have a technically correct round off and a stand alone technically correct standing flip flop. and i can guarantee you that we have less problems. short cutting (that's what the poster is describing) leads to failure over and over again.

 

[iwannacoach]

^^^^And while we're at it^^^^ What's the benifit of continuing on before learning at least a passable, standing bhs. Any of these kids that want to continue past level 6 will want, eventually, to work a bhs on the balance beam. I doubt they'll be training round-off-bhs on beam as a "short cut". So what's the rush, they'll have to learn it some day.

 

[mamaoftwo]

Thank you all for your replies. While I've never been a gymnast myself, it does seem exceptionally logical that DD should have her standing BHS before her ROBHS. If for no other reason than safety. As a parent, that's my primary concern.

She is still doing drills for her standing BHS, but according to DD, it's always on the wedge.

DD tends to dwell on this topic, which is a big reason for this post. She's one of the last two in her group to get it. Although I'd definitely say that nearly 1/2 or the girls are not exactly pretty. At all. Three girls frequently seem to do headsprings. Coaches just watch them during warm-ups. Corrections are later, at the stations. Drives us parents crazy to hear/see that. Anyway, it's a major thing to my DD for her not to have it. I am sure that does not help.

That said, do I dare breech this subject with coaches? Or, should I trust in them?

 

[Quadqueen]

I'm not suggesting that "short-cutting" is ok. I was just trying to explain to mamaoftwo why some kids get the ROBHS before a standing BHS, and that it's normal for a ROBHS to come easier for many gymnasts. As I wrote, her DD should be working on both, and apparently, she is. I'm in no way suggesting she move on to L6 without a good BHS!

 

[skschlag]

We do occassional privates for my son when he is having a block on something. It has to be a significant issue, then we will do one to support him. I always let his coach know if something is scaring him. Right now, it is his moy, and I have told the coach that he is scared. Then the coach understands the situation. Most kiddos won't go in and tell the coach what is going on in their heads, but we will hear it. If I think it is no big deal, I won't say anything, but if ds is really having an issue, I make sure the coach knows so they can work through it in the gym.

 

[Geoffrey Taucer]

I don't see an unspotted standing BHS as an absolute requirement for ROBHS. Assuming a strong roundoff, the BHS is MUCH easier out of a roundoff than out of a stand. The angles are different, the speed is different, the feel is different.

Having said that

While a BHS from stand without a spot may not be a requirement for training one from a roundoff, a clean BHS WITH a spot certainly is, and having one without a spot certainly helps. In an ideal world, I would not teach ROBHS until a kid can do a clean two backhandsprings from a stand.

But every circumstance is different.

 

[Pineapple_Lump]

If a child is not comfortable going backwards to their hands, adding (often uncontrolled) speed by running into a round-off is really not going to help them.

 

[agymmom]

I'm not disputing what anyone is saying, but if a child should have a good BHS before they perform ROBHS then why is a ROHBHS a level 4 skill but a BHS is a level 6 skill?

 

[Deleted member D3987]

i'm not sure i understand your question. 1 concept is sequential and fundamental gymnastics. the other is that these skills are not levels but gymnastics. i don't know what your reference is that BHS is a level 6 skill. can you clarify?

 

[KarenUK]

is it a BHS on beam at level 6?

 

[gymnut1]

What they are referring to is that a ROBHS is included in the level 4 floor routine. A standing BHS (step out) does not appear until the level 6 floor routine. Although I see that more as a prep for the BHS on beam in level 7. I think the poster is asking why don't they include the standing BHS before the ROBHS if it should come first as a skill progression.

 

[gymdog]

There was a standing BHS in level 3 (and a RO BHS in level 4, but not from a run...it was either a step hurdle or power hurdle) when I was a kid. This was the cycle before the one ending now. They took the BHS out of level 3 when they made the lower levels slightly "easier" thinking they could get more kids to compete (no more kip in level 4, etc). Also, there were complaints that since 5 year olds can compete level 3, then we shouldn't have a standing BHS since they aren't supposed to do bridges before that. So now we have the bridge kickover.

Personally with the routines as they are I too would rather see a standing BHS in level 4, and then they can still do RO 2 BHS in level 5. Once they can do standing BHS, and decent RO BHS, RO 2 BHS is really not this big thing. When I was a kid, everyone did RO 2 BHS pretty much the day they did RO BHS. But you weren't even put on a team until you did standing BHS by yourself anyway. Preteams starting at age 3/4 weren't really a thing. Talented kids were picked at 6 or 7 and then accelerated from there, not trained for years to do basic skills.

So, it's up to the coaches to do it that way. But even if you (the individual coach) want to, it depends on your gym structure as well in some cases, trust me on that one. I would get a private lesson with the coach who got her to do it on floor by herself and just say I heard it really upped her confidence when she was doing that with you and then it really helped her other tumbling, I'm hoping you can get her to do the standing one again since it'll really improve her confidence at practice. In this situation I think that's just the best road to take - I'm thinking that coach obviously believes she should have had it on floor and got her to do it before trying the RO.

 

[agymmom]

Thanks gymnut1, that is what I was asking and thanks gymdog for the explanation. It definitely would have been helpful for my dd to have been required to do a BHS prior to a ROBHS but since she didn't need it for the routine, she hasn't learned how to do a good standing BHS.

 

[Geoffrey Taucer]

i'm not sure i understand your question. 1 concept is sequential and fundamental gymnastics. the other is that these skills are not levels but gymnastics. i don't know what your reference is that BHS is a level 6 skill. can you clarify?

There's a standing BHS stepout in the floor routine at level 6 -- I assume this is what the OP was referring to.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

yes. of course.