WAG how to evaluate a brand-new gym

[mommyof1]

Let's say that there's a new gym in town that is starting a team "from scratch" beginning with only Level 3. How would a parent go about evaluating the quality of such a program? Are there indicators that might help predict whether the gym will even stay in business? What are the pitfalls of a gymnast's not having any older, more skilled teammates?

 

[gymdog]

Coaching staff previous experience and professionalism. But if they've never owned before, hard to tell if the gym will succeed from the business side.

 

[iwannacoach]

You just can't tell unless they have a good track record with an earlier successful effort you can evaluate in terms of team program and business success.

Don't put too much weight on professional looks and come on chatter, as it can be there to bring in kids and their parent's wallet, but not deliver when it comes time to move kids through the levels.

The gym's choice to start their team program with L3 as the top level is a wise one. It allows them to concentrate on their own training philosophy and techniques with out contrary attitudes from kids and parents who expected certain things based on the gyms they came from.

You should stay put if you're worried about changing gyms because there's nothing to review. Wait and watch for a year and see if they move a significant number of their L3 kids score well and move up to L4. At least then you can figure they know how to train L3's, and intend to move able kids up based upon each child's progress, The only problem is you can't know what they'll do beyond that.

 

[MaryA]

We switched to a new gym the year that they opened. In fact, we made the decision to switch before they were even open for business. This gym, however, opened for all levels, pre-team through level 10 plus xcel and actually had girls at each level. We based the decision on:
Coach bios
Owner's experience- not just gym experience but business experience
Gym's philosophy
Our dissatisfaction with the other (very limited) options in the area

No gym is perfect, but in general we have been happy with our decision, and the gym has thrived (in fact, the concerns that I do sometimes have about the gym could mainly be attributed to "growing pains" due to faster than expected growth). My concern about joining a gym that ONLY has level 3 would be that one of the best things about DD's current gym is that the older girls on team have been SUCH amazing role models (this was definitely NOT the case at her previous gym where the "queen bees" ruled the roost, if you'll excuse the mixed metaphor). That would be something that your DD would miss out on, especially if they just add one level per year and your DD is always in that "top" group.

 

[Gymsanity]

It's all about the coaches, end of story. Have they coached in the past? Have they been successful? What levels have they coached? As impressive as a new facility may look, a good coach could produce a good athlete in a barn with a few mattresses! I've been in gyms with bare minimum equipment (and less), and state of the art facilities. Been able to produce champions from both, so do your due diligence on the owners and coaching staff, and let that be your determining factor.

 

[gymgymgymnast08]

My concern about joining a gym that ONLY has level 3 would be that one of the best things about DD's current gym is that the older girls on team have been SUCH amazing role models (this was definitely NOT the case at her previous gym where the "queen bees" ruled the roost, if you'll excuse the mixed metaphor). That would be something that your DD would miss out on, especially if they just add one level per year and your DD is always in that "top" group.

I switched gyms when I was going from level 8 to 9. My original gym was ruled by "queen bees" and I was not one of them. I was one of the younger level 8s and the "queen bees" were most of the older level 8s and then pretty much all of the level 9s. Everything was catered to these gymnasts even if it was not the best thing for the rest of the team. Without going into detail, I'll just say it was terrible.

When I switched gyms, I moved up to level 9 and I had only one other level 9 teammate. This team was known for having decent level 8 gymnasts but they never had many successful level 9 gymnasts. However, we knew one of the coaches already and she had coached college gymnastics before and my parents and I were fairly certain she would be a good coach for me. She was and I learned a lot of new skills. I was the first person in the gym to do a lot of skills which was pretty exciting for me. Even though no one in that gym had learned any of the skills I was learning my coach had coached those skills when she was coaching college gymnastics. When I was learning them in our gym, a lot of the other coaches could follow the drills and progressions I did to get the skills and eventually learned to teach those higher level skills themselves. Even though the gym I switched to didn't really have anyone in level 9, with a good coach I was successful.

I was in high school but there were a lot of girls who were older than me so I guess they were the role models. I didn't have any role models skill wise and I think that was good for me because it was more exciting since I was the only person doing x y and z.

It really depends on the gymnast but I was definitely more motivated when I was one of the better gymnasts at the club, rather then when I had a bunch of older teammates who were the same level or higher. It really depends on the gym too but at my original gym all the supposed role models were burnt out and didn't have their passion for gymnastics anymore so even if they were good gymnasts, they weren't someone who I wanted to be like.

A gym in my area started out probably like 10 years ago exactly like that and the girls who were competing level 4 back then are level 9 now and they are pretty successful.

 

[iwannacoach]

I switched gyms when I was going from level 8 to 9. My original gym was ruled by "queen bees" and I was not one of them. I was one of the younger level 8s and the "queen bees" were most of the older level 8s and then pretty much all of the level 9s. Everything was catered to these gymnasts even if it was not the best thing for the rest of the team. Without going into detail, I'll just say it was terrible.

When I switched gyms, I moved up to level 9 and I had only one other level 9 teammate. This team was known for having decent level 8 gymnasts but they never had many successful level 9 gymnasts. However, we knew one of the coaches already and she had coached college gymnastics before and my parents and I were fairly certain she would be a good coach for me. She was and I learned a lot of new skills. I was the first person in the gym to do a lot of skills which was pretty exciting for me. Even though no one in that gym had learned any of the skills I was learning my coach had coached those skills when she was coaching college gymnastics. When I was learning them in our gym, a lot of the other coaches could follow the drills and progressions I did to get the skills and eventually learned to teach those higher level skills themselves. Even though the gym I switched to didn't really have anyone in level 9, with a good coach I was successful.

I was in high school but there were a lot of girls who were older than me so I guess they were the role models. I didn't have any role models skill wise and I think that was good for me because it was more exciting since I was the only person doing x y and z.

It really depends on the gymnast but I was definitely more motivated when I was one of the better gymnasts at the club, rather then when I had a bunch of older teammates who were the same level or higher. It really depends on the gym too but at my original gym all the supposed role models were burnt out and didn't have their passion for gymnastics anymore so even if they were good gymnasts, they weren't someone who I wanted to be like.

A gym in my area started out probably like 10 years ago exactly like that and the girls who were competing level 4 back then are level 9 now and they are pretty successful.

A very positive example of.....It's not what you are, but what you think you are that counts the most.

 

[MaryA]

Not to get too far off topic, but yes, I have definitely seen what it does to a gym atmosphere when it is ruled by the "queen bees." I wasn't talking about being a role model as far as gymnastics skills, though many are that. The older girls at DD's gym are all good students, kind to the younger gymnasts, hard workers, polite to coaches and other adults, etc. No doubt you are a similarly fine role model to the younger girls in your gym and are probably on the list of "good things about our gym" on many parents' lists, as the "big girls" at DD's gym are on mine!

 

[kandkfunk]

Don't put too much weight on professional looks and come on chatter, as it can be there to bring in kids and their parent's wallet, but not deliver when it comes time to move kids through the levels.

Yup. Been there done that. Some people are experts at making themselves look good, but are not worth a lot in substance.

For me, a solid business owner or someone who surrounds themselves with knowledgeable business people is just as important as coaching. Coaches can't coach if the gym goes under.

Our first gym was bought out when my DD was still on preteam. I didn't think much of it. However, the new owner was a good coach but an awful business person. He managed to run the successful gym into the ground and it closed within 3 years.

 

[JoyAvenueMom]

Nothing matters more than who is coaching your kid. However, the management skills of the owners will dictate the quality and stability of the coaching. Some managers can hire good people, but don't know how to keep them. A good leader may make some mistakes, but they correct them quickly and move on. I wouldn't move if it is a coach going into business for themselves for the first time....too risky. Too many coach/owners want to coach, but don't enjoy running the business. Since both can be a full time job, it's hard to find the balance.

 

[Natasha]

Completely agree with JoyAvenueMom. Coaches all have ideals of how they would run a gym and can tell you their philosophy and plans but until they are actually in the position of having to run the gym and make it financially work you will not know how the gym will actually function and how close the reality will be to the ideals. I know a coach who opened up his own gym about 5 years ago because of frustrations of how the team was run by the owner of his gym. 5 years later, his team due to realities of gym management operates pretty much the same as the one he left.
Unless you are unhappy with your current gym, I would not move to a new gym for at least a season.

 

[kandkfunk]

JoyAvenueMom says it very well. I think the OP is in a tough situation as far as evaluating the new gym. I agree with others...If there aren't major issues at your gym, then I would stay put until the new gym has a track record. I can't think of a single case in the past 10 years in our area where a gym has opened with a coaching staff that has no known experience. Most of the time, they are leaving a gym and are able to bring team and sometimes rec kids with them. Evaluating business acumen and even the caliber of coaching is really hard without any background information at all.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

At one point every gym started out, so you can't tell unless the coaches have a history of proven success and even then,, well,,,, coaches are only as great as they continue to strive to be great. In other words, who knows.. Personally I would not run off to a new gym if I were content at my existing gym.

 

[xrachx]

DDs old gym was started up 14 months ago by two experienced coaches (that DD had been with elsewhere previously), so you'd think it would be ok.
However, they have the issue that they grew too fast, didn't have the space, time or coaches to handle the sudden growth, and ultimately a year down the line, they are now losing gymnasts to other clubs.

So even if you have a gym run by coaches with a proven track record, there's still no guarantee it'll be a successful gym

 

[mommyof1]

Thanks for all the replies. I don't want to reveal too many details that might give away our location, but all of this aligns with my gut instinct. There have been some very positive developments at the current gym just within the past few days, so we are staying put for now.

 

[txgymfan]

Dunno knows everyone in the gymnastics community and has helped many CB families with private information about potential coaches and gyms. If you are seriously considering changing gyms I would start a "conversation" ( our version of a private message) with him and ask about the potential of the new gym naming your location and the coaches name. He will be discrete and he will have insider knowledge.

 

[MaryA]

Dunno knows everyone in the gymnastics community and has helped many CB families with private information about potential coaches and gyms. If you are seriously considering changing gyms I would start a "conversation" ( our version of a private message) with him and ask about the potential of the new gym naming your location and the coaches name. He will be discrete and he will have insider knowledge.

Oh, yes... that's a very important thing I left off my list of things I considered before moving DD to the new gym:
Coach bios
Owner's experience- not just gym experience but business experience
Gym's philosophy
Our dissatisfaction with the other (very limited) options in the area
Dunno's advice

 

[StringBean'sMom]

Timely topic - it sounds like our current gym is the same as the one you are considering! We are small but rapidly growing and only have a Level 3 team. My girl started in the rec classes here because it was close to home, convenient and I had *no* idea what we were getting into! I also had no idea that my girl would show such talent and passion for this sport when we started, so we didn't look around at all in the beginning. Now, I'm looking around....

Things I love about the gym - it's small and still growing so all the team member and parents are really close. We have close relationships with the coaches too - very easy to interact and communicate with them The coaches also really love each girl and go out of their way to foster a sense of Team among the girls. We also really have no CGM issues - I'm sure we will grow into them, but none yet!

Downsides - having only Level 3 means our girls are at the top of the totem pole in the entire gym....without having higher level girls to watch and look up to, it's a little too easy for them to get an inflated idea of their "greatness". We don't really have any little "divas" but they sometimes need a reminder of how much further they have to go in their gym journey!

The biggest downside for me is the business end of things - the owner is a really nice person, but lacks a lot of professionalism. There is a very casual way of communicating with parents, which may have worked when the gym was tiny and there were only a few families involved. But now, there is a need to raise the level of professionalism in how things are run. I'm list-making, plan-in-advance, organized person so I don't do well with a "go-with-the-flow, last-minute-planning, let's-just-see-what-happens" style!

I'm generally ok with the coaching end of things on a day-to-day basis but I don't see enough concrete long range planning coming from the owner in how to handle the growth of the gym. There are big plans (hopefully a pit in the next 3-5 years) but I'm not sure there is a plan in place for how to handle the team practices when we have Level 3 and 4 girls next year (which really means in 3.5 months from now in April when our season is over!)! There were a few girls who probably could have competed Level 4 this year, but there wasn't a structure in place to train two levels simultaneously so everyone stayed Level 3 - a little frustrating to hear your kid is being "held" back because of logistics more than her skills.


Generally, I think there is a ton of potential in our gym, but I'm not sure I see the business end of things being handled in a successful way or enough plans in place to keep up with the growth. If I'd known enough when we started, I probably would have chosen one of the more established gyms in our area. Every business is going to have some growing pains, but I'm not sure I want my kid's gymnastics journey to be affected by them.

Now, I'm off to PM Dunno to get opinions on some other gyms in our area!