Making daughter quit for lack of improvement?

[MarR99]

I know that I will probably get a wide variety of opinions on this but I am wanting to find some parents that at least understand what I am going through. My daughter is an 11 year old repeating level 6 gymnast. She did not have a great year last season. She scored around a 34 to low 35 all around for all of the meets. So, her coach advised she repeat the level this year so that she could improve. We have had many changes since then. Her former coach had a baby and left the gym, the replacement coach had little experience coaching gymnastics so after only a month we left and went to a new very highly regarded gym (one that has many elite and collegiate gymnasts). My daughter loves her new gym and is have a great time there. Maybe she is having too much fun though. They have a very positive attitude and unlike her old coach, less extrensic pressure for perfection. They tell the girls what corrections to make, but it needs to be the individual gymnast that makes the corrections. Other girls are still thriving and scoring very high scores at meets, but my DD is actually doing worse than last year on two of the events, vault and floor. Her bar scores have improved by .3 overall and her beam by .5. My husband gave her an ultimatum. She needed to improve this year (not win, not score all 9's just simply improve) or he make her quit. We only have two meets for the season left and if she were to quit today she would be done he says. Part of me is very sad for DD, but the other part of me is wondering if DH is right. As an Optional gymnast we are going to have to invest over $7000 next year alone ($350 a month gym fees, $200 a month driving to and from gym since it is 30 minutes away, $500 choregraphy, $575 new leotard warm ups, and then we have not even added up the meet fees, travel, tape, pre-wrap etc. . . ) When I ask my daughter why she wants to stay in gymnastics she says, "I will miss my friends if I quit." I would think she needs to have a better motivation than that. Sigh. I know that parents sometimes grieve the loss of the sport too since we put so much time, money and effort into helping our little girls succeed in this. It is really hard.

Should I try to convince DH that our daughter needs more time and might improve as an optional gymnast? Should I just be thankful that we realize now that she is not improving and pull her out and save the hours of time and the money? Thanks for any insight.

 

[cher062]

Well I understand the not wanting to put out all that money that's for sure. With that said my question is is she doing gymnastics for FUN first or can she only be in an activity where fun is secondary to success and improvement? The scores of 34 - 35 are good scores and repeating L6 is very common as the jump to L7 in skills is a big one and many L6's who score even higher aren't ready for the L7 skills.

Does it have to be the JO program? Prep Op is a great avenue for gymnasts who want the fun of competition but not all the hours and the parents that want to spend a little less time and money at that the gym. Why does it have to be all or nothing?

Keep in mind repeating a level isn't a failure any type. It is the need to be at a level where your DD will be challenged and safe with the skills she is working on. Getting worse then improving isn't unheard of especially when we are talking about kids who are constantly growing and having to re-establish their center of gravity which means re learning some skills. When my DD's chest grew in almost overnight it seemed there was a big step back for her in her skills to figure out how to move and do the tricks with a set of boobs that after this past year went from flatter than a pancake to a 31 C cup Yes that is a C cup. The hormones that kick in with the mood swings and everything all take a toll. You really have to expect many set backs in improvement when you are dealing with growing kids, pre-teens and teens.

Putting the "you need to improve or else" pressure on a kid I don't think is the way to make it happen. Gymnastics isn't a sprint its a very very Long marathon!! and takes years to gain skills and show improvements in many cases. The "Do it or else" attituded just isn't effective in this sport.

Keep in mind too for 99% of the girls who do this they won't be doing it past high school and a college careere in this sport is the "Olympics" for most girls. FUN FUN FUN should be the first and formost goal. So my question is - Is she having fun while learning?? YES well then you are on track.

 

[bogwoppit]

Hmm I wouldn't make mine quit for lack of progress, as long as she was working hard and enjoying the gym I would leave her be. Some kids just reach a natural plateau and do not progress as fast as others, I cannot imagine forcing my kid to quit when she is doing all she can do. It seems she has made improvement with some scores anyway. It also appears that you think she will be L7 next year, so that must mean that she ha sthe skills to take her there, so that also is progress.

Is hubby wishing that she would be a "winner" at meets? I know I have heard of dads thinking that success means medals.

At 11 she is probably hitting puberty and big body changes, just adapting old skills to a new body is very, very hard.

Just wondering why your husband needs her to improve to justify the expenditure?

But as always each to their own, gym is a pricey sport.

 

[MarR99]

Thanks for the replies. I agree that I should consider that there are plateaus and the body does change. She has grown a little this year so it could be part of it.

I don't think DH cares if she wins or not. I just think he felt that it was not unreasonable to see some improvement after an entire year on vault and floor. It is a long time to train and not see growth. I think he feels that it shows that she has perhaps reached a limit to what she can do.

Also, I think he is tired of seeing me sacrifice so much for the sport, and the family has had to sacrifice too. We have no extra income for anything. We can't take vacations as a family, I have no time to work since I am home-schooling and then driving DD in the afternoons evenings. And our competition season has been really exhausting with 5 meets in a row to begin with that take up the entire Saturday or Sunday. So, he thinks maybe it is time to move on for the good of the entire family. It can get unhealthy for the world to revolve around the little gymnast in the home.

 

[lhmom]

I agree with Cher. And also, it may be that your daughter becomes a better optional gymnast than compulsory. There are several of our optional girls who had "so-so" compulsory years and have done much better on the optional levels. Also, maybe your husband could back off of the "improve scores or you have to quit". Level 6 scoring is already tough-I can't see putting the added pressure helping at all. Good luck!

 

[bogwoppit]

Also, I think he is tired of seeing me sacrifice so much for the sport, and the family has had to sacrifice too. We have no extra income for anything. We can't take vacations as a family, I have no time to work since I am home-schooling and then driving DD in the afternoons evenings. And our competition season has been really exhausting with 5 meets in a row to begin with that take up the entire Saturday or Sunday. So, he thinks maybe it is time to move on for the good of the entire family. It can get unhealthy for the world to revolve around the little gymnast in the home.

Well that is a whole different scenario. If it doesn't work for your family then it is time to stop. Gym is a HUGE commitment and if you are not feeling the love then it is time to pull the plug. You sure wouldn't be the first.We alwsy kept under the 12 hours a week limit and the school bus dropped them at gym three days a week, we never wanted it to take over our lives, we also only ever did three meets a year. I am not sure I could commit to all that US gyms seem to expect from their team families.

 

[Faith]

I would not be making my DD quit for lack of progress. Ever.

In this day and age exercise and activity is one of the fundamentals of life. If it's keeping her fit I'd rather she was in the gym having fun with her friends than sitting on the sofa or hanging round on street corners with nothing to do.

She's 11. And level 6 is pretty good going as far as I understand (sorry we don't have the same system here). Putting pressure on her to achieve x, y or z will make *her* quit, eventually.

Have you looked at other options? Not competing for a year perhaps? If she's happy just going and working out that may be one way of keeping her in the sport, cutting your expenses and taking some pressure off.

If it's genuinely a money issue and you can't afford it then you need a frank discussion with her. What you can and can't afford, make it clear what you will have to sacrifice. But her choice should be based on that reason, rather than she's not "good enough" for you so she should just give up. Wrong message IMO- the reward should be for sticking with something through the bad and good, and not quitting as soon as it gets hard.

Let it be her decision though.

ETA: just seen your update- it sounds like you have given up a lot. I don't know what I'd do in your situation. DOes your DD want to continue? Is her aim elite? If it's anything less maybe time to scale back a bit, go to regular school.

 

[MarR99]

I have thought about the fact that the exercise is so good for her and a reason to stay in gymnastics alone. But, it seems that all of the teams around here expect so much from the girls. We are training 16 hours a week. That will go up to 20 hours in December as an optional gymnast. I know a few gyms expect less hours but I have heard that conditioning is so important for injury prevention that I am cautious to send her there. The higher level skills require more conditioning it seems.

I think that we would be willing to sacrifice the thousands of dollars necessary if we felt that our daughter was more committed to the sport. I am not sure it is wrong to set expectations for a gymnast and then hold them too it though. DH said she just had to improve a little and if she doesn't, why should we say "Oh, well?" I think in life if someone does not improve they get thrown off of the team, lose a job, etc. . . Maybe that is a harsh life lesson at age 11 but perhaps a good one. Granted, I really want her to improve at the last two meets coming up so we don't have to make this decision and we can say, "Great. You did it!"

 

[bogwoppit]

But your expectations of improvement may not be anything she has control over. However, if she is going to L7 she clearly is improving, an 11 year old moving to L7 is very impressive, not really sure what you want to see from her.

This isn't a job, it is supposed to be a pastime she enjoys and uses to keep fit.

You seem to be a little conflicted as to why you want her to stop.

I do not understand how the time and money is better spent if she gets higher scores at meets. It's either about the money, or it isn't.

If the issue is improvement, and really nothing else, then I think you would be crazy to make her stop when she is so active.

JMHO of course.

 

[MarR99]

I know she is improving on some skills, for sure. Perhaps we are at a gym with such amazing talent that DD does not look so great. It is the home an Elite gymnast, and there are other amazing gymnasts younger than her scoring 38 all around. So, that might be tainting our view. But I also see that the hours just keep increasing and in order to succeed at this sport, at some point the gymnast needs to learn how to "bring it" at a meet. My DD is a fun-loving light hearted kid, which I would not ever want to change. But, I think it might be a detriment to a sport that requires intense focus and a bit of a perfectionist attitude. Granted, maybe she could go to level 10 here. But even to get a college scholarship she would need to learn to win at gymnastics meets. So, I guess DH wants to call it quits before we invest any more time and money. Is it crazy to call it quits when DD motivation for being at gym is just to have fun with friends?

 

[bogwoppit]

Is it crazy to call it quits when DD motivation for being at gym is just to have fun with friends?

That is the million dollar question that only you can answer.

 

[shelovestoflip]

As many have said, it seems that you have a few different things going on here.

My daughter is a 12 y/o first year Level 7. She loves gymnastics and that is all I really care about! She does well at meets and that is important to her. But what I love is that she is happy and she loves her gym friends.

I'm a big believer in having friends outside of school. School friends are terrific but her gym friends are different girls and they don't 'compete'...no clothing issues, no grades to worry about, no 'who's sitting with who at the lunch table'....they care about each other for who they are!

This is great for self esteem.

I think you mentioned that you homeschool so if that is the case, if it were me I would want my daughter to have those friendships! If she is home during the day with you (and siblings?) then it makes sense she would miss her friends!

Another thought is that with 2 meets left and your husband looking for 'improvement' I would be worried...we know that sometimes judges score lower at different meets/sessions/event rotation so it would be sad if your daughter's scores were lower due to those reasons. While in theory it's supposed to be apples to apples, in reality it isn't always that clear cut!

Good luck!

 

[MarR99]

Also, I am very conflicted. I hate that I have so little time since my life is wrapped up in helping my little gymnast but I am proud of what she has accomplished so far and I want to see what she is capable of. But, then I question if it is worth the sacrifice, especially when so many girls end up quitting anyways. Also, I an already see that there is such amazing talent at our gym that my daughter is just "average" in comparison. I know, she is in an elite group just to make it to level 7. But, is it worth it to spend so much time and money for the "chance" at a college scholarship. OK, perhaps she is getting great exercise and time with friends but at what price? She can get exercise and time with friends for much less than $7000 + a year. IMHO

 

[MaryA]

That's hard. I mean, you want to say, "If she's enjoying it, let her keep it up!" but then, you're right... if the main reason she's doing it is to hang out with her friends... well, there are lots cheaper ways for her to hang out with her friends. And, of course, the exercise... there are lots cheaper ways for her to get exercise too, of course. Would she? If you told her that gymnastics is done, would she go out for some other sport? My daughter (also a level 6, also competing as an 11-year-old) gets very grumpy with the girls on her team who don't take it as seriously as she does. There are two level 6's who are always playing around, and my DD finds it deeply offensive. One of them is only just barely 8-years-old, which I point out, but she says "Even 8-year-olds can do their best."

My husband also doesn't love the sport. He thinks it's too many hours, too much money, too intense for a 10-year-old. He wishes she had more time to play, that we had more money to travel, that I wasn't constantly at some gym-related meeting. I tell him that I wish that I was that passionate about something when I was her age... heck, I wish I was that passionate about something (besides my family) now! But then she IS totally passionate about the sport, asking for MORE hours in the gym, constantly focussed on what she can do better. If I started to get the impression that gymnastics practice was basically a social event for her... well, I might give it a bit of time. I think these things do go in waves like anything else. But if it was on-going, I might make my daughter take some time off from team... continue with some rec classes, try some other activities, take a dance class, join some after-school clubs, invite her friends over more often, and see how it goes. If, when the next season rolls around, she's BEGGING to be back on the team, well, then maybe she will start again with more focus. Or she might learn that there are other places to have a social life besides the gym. This is a hard question with no right or wrong answer. I think you and your daughter and your husband need to sit down and talk about it seriously... no threats, no "If you don't accomplish x,y, and z, then you're off the team" but more just sharing how you each feel about it.

I hope you'll let us know how this all turns out!

 

[bogwoppit]

My 12 year old quit gym back in May, she loved her friends, but HATED beam and bars, despite them being her best apparatus. She was also about a L6, but as we are already all optionals in Canada she already had her own routines. I, of course, let her quit but told her that I expected her to find some new things to fill her time and in our tiny town that is tough.

She literally did no organised sports between May and Sept, and boy I could tell. But since then she joined an All Start cheer team, a school cheer team, took up horse riding and will join her highschool basketball team when it starts next month, so she is plenty busy with activities and with friends in them. This is WAY cheaper, she is happy and still keeping fit.

I do not think mine would have ever progressed to L7 skills, tiny gym, limited hours etc etc. But if she hadn't quit, she'd still be going, even if it was just because of friends.

In the end, not matter what advice you are given, only you can decide what feels right to you.

 

[MarR99]

It is agonizing. I was hesitant to even let my DD start gymnastics 4 years ago. My older daughter's best friend was a gymnast and her life seemed so crazy that I vowed NEVER to let my daughter do the sport. Then my younger DD begged, and begged and finally I gave in and let her join a rec team. She was really good. So, we went from 9 hours, to 12 hours to 15 and then 20 hours a week (in the Summer). The money increased, the stress increased. I decided to home-school so I could see my DD a little, and not have her stay up till 10 or 11 PM after gym to do the 2 or 3 hours of homework our local school was dishing out (my older daughter had to do that many hours at grade 4, 5 and 6!) Now our lives are intertwined in a sport that is all-encompassing and DD seems to only care about hanging out with friends. I would hope that she would start to care more about the scores but what if she never does? I would think the main goal at this point is college. If not, then is it worth so much of our lives for only the recreational purpose and for friends? I have had to put my dreams on hold for DD to pursue hers and it seems disrespectful for her to be so laid back about it. Granted, she is only 11 but I would think at some point it is OK for a Mom and Dad to say "you need to improve or or you are done." At least we put the ball in her court and if she can't improve why is it wrong to hold her to that? I say all of this with mixed emotions though. Sigh. It is so hard.

 

[MdGymMom01]

Here is my take on this--If gym is getting to the point where it is very expensive (getting to the point where it is beyond your means), it takes up too much family time, and hours would become too much in the near future, then these reasons ALONE are enough to call it quits. Improving or not improving shouldn't even be factored into this equation. Because even if she kicks it into high gear and "improves" for the last 2 meets, these issues are STILL going to be there next year and the year after that.

It does sound like there are a lot more issues going on that is clouding your view and making it difficult for you to make a wise family decision (taking into account everyone's considerations). Good luck--this can be a very tough decision.

 

[lhmom]

It is agonizing. I was hesitant to even let my DD start gymnastics 4 years ago. My older daughter's best friend was a gymnast and her life seemed so crazy that I vowed NEVER to let my daughter do the sport. Then my younger DD begged, and begged and finally I gave in and let her join a rec team. She was really good. So, we went from 9 hours, to 12 hours to 15 and then 20 hours a week (in the Summer). The money increased, the stress increased. I decided to home-school so I could see my DD a little, and not have her stay up till 10 or 11 PM after gym to do the 2 or 3 hours of homework our local school was dishing out (my older daughter had to do that many hours at grade 4, 5 and 6!) Now our lives are intertwined in a sport that is all-encompassing and DD seems to only care about hanging out with friends. I would hope that she would start to care more about the scores but what if she never does? I would think the main goal at this point is college. If not, then is it worth so much of our lives for only the recreational purpose and for friends? I have had to put my dreams on hold for DD to pursue hers and it seems disrespectful for her to be so laid back about it. Granted, she is only 11 but I would think at some point it is OK for a Mom and Dad to say "you need to improve or or you are done." At least we put the ball in her court and if she can't improve why is it wrong to hold her to that? I say all of this with mixed emotions though. Sigh. It is so hard.

If she's just truly wanting to hang out with friends, then maybe prep-op or a few rec classes a week is the answer, especially if it's a financial issue. She still gets to do gymnastics but it's not taking over the family's life. Like some others, I am leery about basing this decision on improvement in scores. I've seen meets where I thought DD did well and the scores would be lower than when she maybe had a few bobbles at another meet. That's why any season goals that she makes are not based on scores (or at least it's what we encourage). In her next few meets, your daughter may get much tougher judges than she had previously. How can she be held responsible for that?

 

[MarR99]

I guess we have been making it financially, but we certainly are not able to have many luxuries. We have to watch our money very carefully and the idea of taking a nice vacation is certainly out of the question. So, I suppose I don't want to make money the main issue because if we have to, we will make it work because I really want to give my DD the opportunity to succeed at something she is good at. But it is a big factor and a big sacrifice for the family as a whole.

 

[MarR99]

In her next few meets, your daughter may get much tougher judges than she had previously. How can she be held responsible for that?

I know that judges can vary. We have had 6 meets to compare so far though, so we are looking at the averages over all of them compared to the averages of last year. I would have never used this tactic. But, DH came up with it being the analytical one. Perhaps it is too harsh. I am not sure. I know that in some sports Stats are used for making decisions though so maybe it is not as bad as it seems at first glance.