Parents Coaching changes/no level change

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Lilou

Proud Parent
My daughter was told to stay a level 3 for her summer training group, even though she had a solid season, scoring in the 9s in all events at meets, often mid-high 9s in bars. Her coach is wonderful so we didn't have an issue with this and my daughter would still uptrain 4/5 skills and make a move to level 4 at the end of the summer should all skills, attitude, etc... fall in to place. This is totally acceptable to us.
Well, fast forward a month, we're just starting our summer training schedule next week and my daughter has all of her level 4 skills, straight arm kip, over the vault table, floor skills, etc... she just took off training hard with knowing she had to push if she wanted to get to level 4. The coach texted me saying she felt 'very confident' moving my child to level 4 training now this summer and working to perfect the skills for meets in 5 months. And here is where the trouble starts. The coach was just let go and I won't go into details. It's a shame because my daughter and this coach were wonderful together. Unfortunately it often takes about a month for my kid to get used to a new coach (which she'll have now in L3 starting in two weeks) and slides backwards during this time as she gets acclimated with a new coach.
I asked if they would move her to 4 now considering her current coach (the one they let go) said she's ready and she is already comfortable with the level 4 coach. Then we can avoid having to get used to another new coach.
They are just saying, no one is moving anywhere now. No changes, the summer training groups are what they are. I'm pretty confused as to what to do and am not confident in appropriately navigating how summer move ups typically work. like I don't want to ask anything inappropriate or at inappropriate timing. But what's bothering me is, Why wouldn't they move a kid the coach says is ready and they know would transition better with a familiar coach than a new coach who just joining the gym? Summer training hasn't even started yet. I'm at a loss as to how to approach this. I'm not feeling clear in my head. Thoughts to help me see clearer? We don't want to leave the gym by the way. I just don't know how to best approach it further, or not.
 
Taking a step back from being a gym parent, I'll just give some perspective as someone who used to teach and then ran a large preschool. What you're suggesting may make sense in the limited context of just your child. BUT the gym isn't making decisions about only your child, and you very well may not be the only parent asking for a move. Some may just not want to take a chance on a new coach, some may be pushing for a move up because their daughter wants to move up or the parent is overestimating their abilities, some may want their kids to stay with friends... and so on. A lot of times in my job I had to make decisions based on the question "if I granted an exception/accommodated a similar request for EVERY child whose parents asked, will I create chaos or problems in my classroom or school?" If the answer is yes, I often had to say no. Even if I could have granted that one specific request with minimal problems.

Your gym or head coach may have other reasons for saying no in this case, but this is a perspective to consider.
 
Thank you for your perspective. I don't really like the "if I said yes to one, I have to say yes to all" because it's important to look at each child individually and do what's best for that child. Some answers then are yes, some are no. And there's a big difference in my mind of a parent asking for something they 'think' versus a coaches recommendation, and the gym knowing my kid takes a bit of time to warm up to new coaches. So, I do see your perspective and maybe that is the approach the gym is taking. That might explain where we are in this situation. Thx

Taking a step back from being a gym parent, I'll just give some perspective as someone who used to teach and then ran a large preschool. What you're suggesting may make sense in the limited context of just your child. BUT the gym isn't making decisions about only your child, and you very well may not be the only parent asking for a move. Some may just not want to take a chance on a new coach, some may be pushing for a move up because their daughter wants to move up or the parent is overestimating their abilities, some may want their kids to stay with friends... and so on. A lot of times in my job I had to make decisions based on the question "if I granted an exception/accommodated a similar request for EVERY child whose parents asked, will I create chaos or problems in my classroom or school?" If the answer is yes, I often had to say no. Even if I could have granted that one specific request with minimal problems.

Your gym or head coach may have other reasons for saying no in this case, but this is a perspective to consider.
 
I would let it go. It sounds like she would still be able to keep working L4 skills anyways in the L3 group they want to keep her in. If they are going to have her keep working and perfecting the L4 skills, what difference does it make? You've said nothing to indicate that the original plan of her moving to L4 at the end of the summer will change even with the new coach. And you've said that the plan of her staying in L3 over the summer was acceptable to you.

Also, I completely understand your DD needing time to get used to a new coach. Transitions to new coaches were always difficult for my DD too until she got used to the coaching style and personality of the new coach. My DD would also sometimes slip a little backwards when adjusting to a new coach so I get it. But at the same time, this shouldn't necessarily be the gym's problem either. Coaching changes for whatever reason happen (coach quits or gets fired, kid moves up to a new level with different coaches, or the gym rearranges coaches) and your DD does need to learn to adapt. It's pretty common for kids to need time to get used to a new coach. I disagree with the need to move her up just so she can be with a coach she is familiar with.

One more thing I'll add is that you don't have the big picture goal with the new coach. Often times when a new coach starts at DD's gym, there is an eventual shifting around of coaches based on whatever talents the new coach brings. The new coach may start working with one group or one event to 'fill a hole' but over the next few months transition into a different event or level. So there's no guarantee that this new coach will be always working with the L3 group.
 
Thank you for this perspective too. I was fine with her staying in the L3 training group and uptraining when it was the coach she does awesome with. Now that we have an unknown coach, who I just found out has never coached level 4 before, I'm concerned. She's young and the group will consist of new level 2 & 3 and 2 girls who were L3 last year who are uptraining 4/5 (1 being my daughter). They will all train together and move from event to the event together.

The reason I asked about having her moved up is because the coach told me she felt confident in moving her up, meaning moving her up for the summer training group, out of 3 and into the 4 training group. It's not originating from me.I know better. lol But she was let go now.

We are a small gym and understaffed so the new coach is in fact staying with the 2/3s. I'd be hugely surprised if there was shuffling around since I haven't seen that in 3 years. My daughter had 4 coaches this past season. So, yes, transitions are hard sometimes and I think she's done quite well overall considering she had 4 coaches in 1 season (not all were good either). At this point, I'm looking for solid coaching and stability. The coach told me she was ready to move to the L4 summer training group, there's a good and familiar coach there, so I'm not understanding why they aren't moving her. (I'm a bit frustrated so I apologize if it comes out). I may have to let it go ultimately and just watch and see how it all unfolds.

I would let it go. It sounds like she would still be able to keep working L4 skills anyways in the L3 group they want to keep her in. If they are going to have her keep working and perfecting the L4 skills, what difference does it make? You've said nothing to indicate that the original plan of her moving to L4 at the end of the summer will change even with the new coach. And you've said that the plan of her staying in L3 over the summer was acceptable to you.

Also, I completely understand your DD needing time to get used to a new coach. Transitions to new coaches were always difficult for my DD too until she got used to the coaching style and personality of the new coach. My DD would also sometimes slip a little backwards when adjusting to a new coach so I get it. But at the same time, this shouldn't necessarily be the gym's problem either. Coaching changes for whatever reason happen (coach quits or gets fired, kid moves up to a new level with different coaches, or the gym rearranges coaches) and your DD does need to learn to adapt. It's pretty common for kids to need time to get used to a new coach. I disagree with the need to move her up just so she can be with a coach she is familiar with.

One more thing I'll add is that you don't have the big picture goal with the new coach. Often times when a new coach starts at DD's gym, there is an eventual shifting around of coaches based on whatever talents the new coach brings. The new coach may start working with one group or one event to 'fill a hole' but over the next few months transition into a different event or level. So there's no guarantee that this new coach will be always working with the L3 group.
 
Groups, Levels, don’t matter. Skills matter. If she is doing skills it’s good.

And understandably it would be nice to completely individualize per child. That’s called private’s.

It is unrealistic to be that individualized in a group environment. And seriously I’m sure there are many parents who would like their kids in different groups.

If you are uncomfortable with how the gym handles things it’s time to move elsewhere.
 
The reason I asked about having her moved up is because the coach told me she felt confident in moving her up, meaning moving her up for the summer training group, out of 3 and into the 4 training group. It's not originating from me.I know better. lol But she was let go now.
Fair or not. You understand that the opinion of a coach who was let go might not carry much weight and in fact may actually work against you all.
 
To me, the most frustrating thing about this sport is that there isn't individualized training. I played an individual sport competitively my whole life so I am sure there are benefits, I just don't know what they are. Do you know if your daughter is getting moved up in a month? If yes, I'd just wait it out. If not, I'd start looking for a back up plan because without your champion, you may not be happy with the outcome.
 
Absolutely agree. I feel like there should be some individualized training within the groups. I have no clue if or when my daughter may be moving up. The head coach said she'll start watching some practices from time to time over the summer and see if or when she wants to move her up. I'm going to wait it out I guess since my daughter does not want to leave the gym and overall I think it's a good place. Thanks for offering up ideas and opinions.

To me, the most frustrating thing about this sport is that there isn't individualized training. I played an individual sport competitively my whole life so I am sure there are benefits, I just don't know what they are. Do you know if your daughter is getting moved up in a month? If yes, I'd just wait it out. If not, I'd start looking for a back up plan because without your champion, you may not be happy with the outcome.
 
Honestly, I see a lot of red flags and I'd consider checking other gyms. Having a kid who scored 9s across the board and has bars from last season, has a straight arm kip, and can vault over the table continue to work with new L2 and L3 kids... Red flag. That level of coach turnover. HUGE Red flag. Was the L3 team last year only 2 girls or were only 2 girls held back to the L3 training group? How many girls are in this L2/3/4 training group? How many are in the L4 training group? If the rest of last year's team moved to the L4 training group then honestly, it sounds to me like they are planned to have her repeat L3 for some reason. I'd have a meeting with the gym and then decide from there what to do.
 
Her straight arm kip and going over the vault table is fairly new, about 2-3 weeks so when they made level change decisions about 4-5 weeks ago, they had her stick in 3. She was disappointed but I could see their reason why (she was doing kips, but slithering herself up, couldn't get over the vault table without a spot...) and since the coach was awesome, it all made sense to me and we accepted it.

There were just 2 girls held back from the level 3 team last year ( it was a very small team to begin with). I don't know how many girls will be in the L2/3/4 training group, but I'm guessing about 10-12. I think there are 8-9 in the L4 training group but I won't know until I see it. I do think they have planned to have her repeat 3 too but I don't know why now that she's on a roll getting level 4 skills. I'm weary that the new coach won't be able to foster her continued development and she'll just stagnate now and end up repeating 3 simply because the new coach coming in doesn't have the experience coaching 4 to actually get her there.

I had a meeting with the head coach and they really talk in a roundabout way, saying one thing, then a minute later saying the complete opposite. The HC is super nice and I think the gym truly believe they are trying and doing their best and thinking about the kids. I just never get solid answers except 'if she has all of the skills, we'll move her up'. That's their 'go to' response they tell parents to pacify them, and I've watched kids move up who don't have skills at all, others like mine get over-looked for a reason or another. I give up trying to understand it all. But it does make me frustrated wish we were in a diff sport altogether sometimes.

Honestly, I see a lot of red flags and I'd consider checking other gyms. Having a kid who scored 9s across the board and has bars from last season, has a straight arm kip, and can vault over the table continue to work with new L2 and L3 kids... Red flag. That level of coach turnover. HUGE Red flag. Was the L3 team last year only 2 girls or were only 2 girls held back to the L3 training group? How many girls are in this L2/3/4 training group? How many are in the L4 training group? If the rest of last year's team moved to the L4 training group then honestly, it sounds to me like they are planned to have her repeat L3 for some reason. I'd have a meeting with the gym and then decide from there what to do.
 
I had a meeting with the head coach and they really talk in a roundabout way, saying one thing, then a minute later saying the complete opposite. The HC is super nice and I think the gym truly believe they are trying and doing their best and thinking about the kids. I just never get solid answers except 'if she has all of the skills, we'll move her up'. That's their 'go to' response they tell parents to pacify them, and I've watched kids move up who don't have skills at all, others like mine get over-looked for a reason or another. I give up trying to understand it all. But it does make me frustrated wish we were in a diff sport altogether sometimes.
This must be a common problem because about a month ago I spoke to the head coach and assistant head coach at my son's gym and I was literally told that he "was definitely moving up" and also "might not move up" in the same conversation. Luckily, he is in the next level training group for the summer, but gym owners and coaches could absolutely use some training in communication!:p
 
My experience, at multiple gyms, is that if she is in the summer training group for a lower level then she is going to do the lower level. Generally if there is someone on the cusp that they are really considering moving up they have them summer train the higher level and move them down at the end of summer if the skills don't come. Honestly, if someone has a kip that is being muscled up 5-6 months before L4 season starts then odds are good that they will have a solid kip by season, as has happened with your DD. It is the kid who has no kip who is the concern. Working with the L3 group, how is your kid supposed to work vault? The vault setups are completely different between those levels.

In the end, if my kid had a solid level 3 year (which consistent 9s on all events is solid) and had the L4 skills this long before season, I would not be ok with a plan of likely repeating L3. Repeating L4 I'd be more open to, but just spending more time on stuff like a mill circle would not be where I'd want to put our family's time and money.
 
Completely agree with the above post. The summer training group seems to be the level for the season unless a kid is really struggling with a key skill or two.
 
I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment. I even could foresee my child repeating level 4 as it seems to be a trickier level with important skills. But repeat 3 when she's got the 4 skills (although they definitely need work) and solid scores just doesn't sit well with me.

We spoke today and my daughter adamantly does not want to leave the gym or her friends. It puts me in a tough spot but it's why I'd like to exhaust all options are our current gym. I'm hoping once the new coach comes in and sees all 15 kids in her new training group, and sees my kid stand out (which she totally did today), that she'll move her. But we'll see.

My experience, at multiple gyms, is that if she is in the summer training group for a lower level then she is going to do the lower level. Generally if there is someone on the cusp that they are really considering moving up they have them summer train the higher level and move them down at the end of summer if the skills don't come. Honestly, if someone has a kip that is being muscled up 5-6 months before L4 season starts then odds are good that they will have a solid kip by season, as has happened with your DD. It is the kid who has no kip who is the concern. Working with the L3 group, how is your kid supposed to work vault? The vault setups are completely different between those levels.

In the end, if my kid had a solid level 3 year (which consistent 9s on all events is solid) and had the L4 skills this long before season, I would not be ok with a plan of likely repeating L3. Repeating L4 I'd be more open to, but just spending more time on stuff like a mill circle would not be where I'd want to put our family's time and money.
 
As you wait for the new coach, I would definitely investigate other gyms. Search CB for how to look for a new gym using your super secret spy skills ( and I’m really not kidding). Bottom line, you need to be prepared to make a tough decision and it would be better for everyone to do it sooner rather than later. Do NOT let your current gym know that you are exploring other options.
 
If she has only just gotten the level 4 skills in the last few weeks, it is quite normal for coaches to be hesitant to move her up. With skills that are fairly new, gymnast may lose them just as easily. They may want to see that she can do them for a period of time, to ensure she really has those skills before committing to allow her to compete at that level.
 

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