MAG DS and his enemy, the mushroom

[Sourkey]

Newbie here. I've read all the posts about challenges with mushrooms and how one day it just "clicks" but I'm wondering if it just doesn't click for some?

DS is now crying every night (started last week) because he can't reliably do 5 circles. He says his coach is being extra hard on him and he's devastated. He has to spend extra time on the mushroom instead of doing other things. I've tried to tell him that his coach is trying to help by giving him more time to practice and he's pushing him because he knows he can do it.

He's 8 and has been struggling with circles for the past year. He will only start competing this year (last year was just unscored fun meets). He's really strong with the rings, high bar and floor but the mushroom is making him want to quit. This is the kid who arrives at the gym an hour early because he's so excited to be there.

We asked his coach about getting him a mushroom but he advised against it because he said he's already there 16 hours a week and doesn't want to risk injury at home. His coach doesn't seem worried about his lack of circle progress.

So, do they really eventually get the circles? He is just so frustrated and I don't know how to help him.

 

[skschlag]

they do all eventually get circles. Some are better at them than others. It is one of those skills that does come one day.

He is doing a lot of hours for 8years old (for reference, my 15 yo training L10 does 20), so he will get them with the coaching. Frustrating yes, but they will come. In the meantime, just let him vent, then have him tell you something that went well at practice, and then help him let it go

Good luck to him!

 

[krc]

The mushroom will come in time. If the kids are shorter, floppier or wider it takes longer. The skinny-twig kids learn circles earlier and more easily. But more importantly, 16 hours for a 8 yr old????

 

[Sourkey]

I'm somewhat reassured that the circles will eventually happen. He has mentally convinced himself that he's awful at it and I'm sure that's not helping. I hate to see him feel so much pressure about it.

I really don't know what standard practice hours are. 16 hours seems high to me but in pre-comp he was doing 12. He turns 9 in the fall but their ages for competitions are determined as of Sept 1. We're in Canada so our levels are different. He'd live at the gym if it were up to him (and if he didn't have to face a mushroom again!)

 

[strawberries]

Funniest subject line ever!!

 

[krc]

A good plan is to vary the circles. High mushroom and low mushroom, on a floor buck (short horse), ft, back and side circles on long horse. All these variations will help the process, and reduce boredom/frustration. In all seriousness, watch for overuse injuries, especially wrists, shoulders and lower back. That is a lot of hours in the gym for a little one. It can be done safely of course, but without proper progressions, strengthening and rest, problems can arise.

Best of luck,
KRC

 

[Madden3]

Gotta say I am not a big fan of making a kid do much extra time on something that is slower in coming. (Unless the kid wants to.) I can see why that would cause your son to feel pressure.

Plus we learned the hard way to be careful about overtraining circles as it can be really hard on the wrists- especially watch out for that once he can do many circles in a row. Because I have no doubt, that day is coming.

My kids both took forever to get consistent circles, but eventually they did. PH is now one of my older son's better events!

 

[eucoach]

Talk to the coach! Tell him how your son feels. Chances are that he believes he is helping him and has no idea how much it stresses him out.

If he is fairly reasonable he will understand and take the appropriate measures. Taking a break from the skill, working one on one, being more patient and encouraging, ...

 

[profmom]

It really does just take longer to click for some kids. The only solution is patience and time, but that solution, I'd say, works about 99% of the time if the kid just sticks with it. We had a guy who struggled terribly with mushroom -- it took him three years to get to the magic 5 circle point. But he did get there, and never looked back. I do think varying it helps just because it makes it less boring, even if it's still frustrating. Does your son's gym have a bucket? That's another way to go where they can get some decent numbers in without as much stress on the wrists.

I'd talk to the coach and gently suggest that the extra pressure is counterproductive, tell your son that a lot of really great optional guys went through phases when they wanted to set all mushrooms on fire, and do everything you can to dial down the stakes for him. It will come, and when it does, it will be beautiful!!

(Agreed on time -- my guy was at 5 hours a week for L4 and 12 for L5. Keep a sharp eye on his wrists as he begins to grow and gain muscle weight.)

One more time -- in all the years in my son's gym, I have NEVER seen a team guy fail to get mushroom. Never. Not once.

 

[Sourkey]

Talk to the coach! Tell him how your son feels. Chances are that he believes he is helping him and has no idea how much it stresses him out.

If he is fairly reasonable he will understand and take the appropriate measures. Taking a break from the skill, working one on one, being more patient and encouraging, ...

You're right - we should talk to him. My husband briefly mentioned something at the beginning of the last practice when he asked about getting a mushroom at home, and the coach was receptive and acknowledged he'd had him spend more time on the mushroom but would give him a break from on it on that day. DS was still trying last night though about it (and he doesn't cry often). I really respect the coaches and don't want to be an overly intense parent who is trying to direct the practice, but I will ask if there's a different strategy that could be used since this isn't motivating him and he feels like he is being punished.

 

[Sourkey]

It really does just take longer to click for some kids. The only solution is patience and time, but that solution, I'd say, works about 99% of the time if the kid just sticks with it. We had a guy who struggled terribly with mushroom -- it took him three years to get to the magic 5 circle point. But he did get there, and never looked back. I do think varying it helps just because it makes it less boring, even if it's still frustrating. Does your son's gym have a bucket? That's another way to go where they can get some decent numbers in without as much stress on the wrists.

I'd talk to the coach and gently suggest that the extra pressure is counterproductive, tell your son that a lot of really great optional guys went through phases when they wanted to set all mushrooms on fire, and do everything you can to dial down the stakes for him. It will come, and when it does, it will be beautiful!!

(Agreed on time -- my guy was at 5 hours a week for L4 and 12 for L5. Keep a sharp eye on his wrists as he begins to grow and gain muscle weight.)

One more time -- in all the years in my son's gym, I have NEVER seen a team guy fail to get mushroom. Never. Not once.

They do have a bucket and that's what he used quite a bit last year, but he said that they're not allowed to use it now that he's in the higher level. I don't know if this is actually true. Everything else comes very easily to him and he is very dedicated (he was the only kid last year who went to his practice on Halloween -- not because we made him!) but this mushroom is just a new kind of challenge for us. If he comes home grumpy from practice, we know it's because of the mushroom!

I'm just relieved that the kids do eventually get it, even if it takes a few years. His first competition is in December and it's expected that he'll be able to do 5. I suppose he may just score low on that event (which is okay for us, but he won't handle that well!).

I'm curious to see what his level translates to for US levels. I think our gym, for the boys especially, has longer hours of practice per week. They do spend the first chunk warming up, and the last 45 mins consists of mostly stretching. It's broken up into 4, 4 hour practices.

 

[profmom]

Tell us what skills he has/is working on, and we'll tell you how that would fit into the US system. It's good that your gym does a lot of warming up and stretching. Helps with injury prevention.

 

[skschlag]

Sometimes, kids for whom everything else comes easily, do frustrate quickly when they encounter that skill that does not. Fortunately, while hard to watch, he is learning an important skill that will help him not only in gymnastics, but later in life. The perseverance to push thru this difficult time will be rewarded, and he will learn that hard work does pay off.

Now the crying is hard, and we all know does not help, but I bet it is helping him process this.

Encourage, but don't push. When my son is struggling with something, we do not even discuss it unless he brings it up. It just frustrates him more. We are his soft place to land, and that has helped over the years.

 

[gymmomx2]

They do come but it takes longer for some kids...it took 2 years for my son! 4 years later, he's now really good at pommel and often places on that event so tell your DS that early struggles don't mean that he won't ever be good at it [emoji846]

 

[lilmisssunshine]

Are those practice hours year-round or just during the summer? I would think that a lot of kids at gyms easily hit the 16 hour mark during the summer....
At the last gym, it was pretty standard for team kids to do at least 20 hours when they were there. Some of the older boys went "full time" (including my son), which meant 40 hours (although that includes a lunch break). This year, when there's "camp", my son does 15 hours of camp plus his usual 9 hours of evening practice. There's a lot of fun stuff in there, so it's not training all the time, but still.

I agree that 16 hours seems high for a young kid during the school year. But just wanted to point the summer thing off if this is the case...

 

[Sourkey]

Tell us what skills he has/is working on, and we'll tell you how that would fit into the US system. It's good that your gym does a lot of warming up and stretching. Helps with injury prevention.

I can only go by what I've seen at his fun meets or the rare time I've had to stop by mid-practice for something. We aren't there for practices since the gym is just 5 minutes away from our house so I rarely know what he's working on unless he tells me. Because we have fewer levels, I think the skills would overlap multiple US levels. I don't know what half the things are called anyway.

rings:
- muscle up
- some sort of swinging forward and backwards in circles that make me think his shoulders are going to pop out.
- a handstand with bent arms
- some sort of flip when he's dismounting

floor
- roundoff, back handspring, backflip
- frontflip, front handspring
- press to handstand

high bar
- he can sometimes do a kip, other times it's pull-up and then he does a circle to get up on the bar
- he is working on giants but can't do them on his own, needs something called "chicken grips"

vault & p-bars - I don't really know what the skills are called. He tries to do a big swing to get onto the p-bars but I haven't seen him do it successfully.

mushroom - usually falls off after one or two circles.

 

[Sourkey]

@lilmisssunshine - those hours are during the school year as well. When he first started, it was 12 hours starting in the summer and it continued into the school year.

He had two weeks off at the beginning of July then started in his new level which requires 16 hours, even during school but thankfully the practices are evenings and weekends so we don't have to take him out of school. My girls are also starting developmental programs in September (wag and trampoline) so we will be dropping a kid off at the gym every single day of the week.

 

[gymmomx2]

Are you in Ontario? Those hours aren't unusual for Ontario, some kids do even more.

Is he doing L1 this year if he needs 5 circles?

 

[Sourkey]

Are you in Ontario? Those hours aren't unusual for Ontario, some kids do even more.

Is he doing L1 this year if he needs 5 circles?

Yes we're in Ontario. I think he will be in L1. His group is provincial 1-3 and he has most of the 2 skills (I'm told) except for that darn mushroom.

I didn't think the hours were unusual until others pointed it out. Overall from someone who has no gym background it seemed like a lot of hours but because he generally loves it, I didn't think twice.

 

[gymmomx2]

Yes we're in Ontario. I think he will be in L1. His group is provincial 1-3 and he has most of the 2 skills (I'm told) except for that darn mushroom.

I didn't think the hours were unusual until others pointed it out. Overall from someone who has no gym background it seemed like a lot of hours but because he generally loves it, I didn't think twice.

My kid did 20 hours at L1, but he was a bit older. It's not unusual for Ontario if you want to be competitive.

He is actually doing very well for an 8 year old, don't worry about the circles, they will come and before you know it he will be doing 10-100 of them in a row!