MAG JD question

[Jacob]

I have a gymnast who is sixteen years old, and has only been doing gymnastics for about a year and half. He is interested in competing in the Junior Developmental Division. He does not want to compete level 5 compulsory because he is embarrassed at the competitions because of his age/size compared to the other kids. Would he be able to compete in the JD division with the skill level of a level 5? The only concerning events would be vault and pommel horse because he can’t do circles on the actual horse or go over the table.

 

[skschlag]

So, I think that is the intent of the JD division, partly. I think he would struggle in that division as well, but if he is ok with that, then I would say to go for it. He can also just compete the events he is ready for, and then add the others as he gets them.

 

[gracyomalley]

It will be interesting what happens with JD. My oldest is doing it this year - also 16 (although he will compete as a 17 year old due to an end of spring birthday, so ? not your son's group). Our gym owner was just looking at the boys meets with me to see which ones would offer the JD division and happily there are 3-4 that will, and we are a small state, so sounds like there will be enough kids doing it to make a go.

Not sure how a kid with your son's level of skill will match up - here JD seems to be mostly kids who would have been levels 8-9 but are now considered too old with the new rules... or teens who can no longer dedicate enough time to gym to be able to do L10 but don't want to be done. most of whom were late starters, but not as late as your son. With time I hope that it will open up to more kids like yours.

Honestly, I have no idea what JD routines even HAVE to include (as far as number of skills) but putting together routines with enough skills might be the hard part for your son. Vault might have a fair number of boys still doing FHS or Yami...so if he can learn to get over the vault by then it might go...but it will also include kids like my son who will do a Tsuk Layout...or even a Tsuk double...so the variability could be quite huge. So it would be a choice between competing with his skill group but being the older "role model" or competing with his age group but limited events or expecting to struggle. Different kids are more comfortable with those options.

I will say that at 16 if your son really works hard and has good coaches then in the areas he's most skilled at he may make huge gains over the next few months...on the other hand, if he wants to stay in gym a few more years, nothing wrong with competing the bare minimum required by the gym, at whatever level, and concentrating on training for next year - there are always a couple of older L5-7s at meets and the L5 skills are pretty fundamental for the next stuff - DS spent 3 years there then jumped up rather quickly to L7 then L8...

DS is concentrating on staying fit and being a role model for the younger boys, maybe gaining a few skills in his "easy" events this year, and that approach for your DS, whatever he competes, might make meets more valuable.

 

[skschlag]

I actually think the age division are 11-14 and 15-18. NOt sure how they will break out. From waht I understand, they have to do 6 skills, maybe 8 at 10, but I would have to look taht up and I don't have it here.

I agree with above..the skill level will be a huge variable. DS is competing doubles, double fulls, etc, but once he gets his skills back he will jump over to level 9. He is doing JD to try to go slower getting his skills back and not get hurt again!

 

[gracyomalley]

skschlag, you are probably correct about age ranges...I've been a drop off pick up parent this year, and letting the boys and the their coaches sort things out. DS has no idea what his routines will be yet but is in the position of being able to just do what he did for L8 with a few added skills (and if his ankles hold up higher level dismounts) and not much thought about it, and right now just trying to keep school/music and some gym all together . So happy your son is hanging in there with a plan that will hopefully make for a better year!

 

[krc]

In the JD level difficulty doesn't count for score. So double full vs tuck back won't matter - only execution. A beginner will go head to head with a more experienced gymnast and the gymnast with the better execution will score higher regardless of difficulty. For some beginners though, the hard part will be coming up with six parts. Especially on PH if you can't circle, or HB without giants. But coaches old enough to remember freshman HS routines can probably put something together

The program is aimed at 3 groups; the late starter, the late bloomer, and the level transition kid. Naturally there will be some compromises, but by focusing on execution only, the gymnasts can work on their specific difficulty needs at their own pace.

KRC

 

[skschlag]

OK. That explains why D's base routines are pretty basic. They are working in the harder skills, but those won't be ready in December, especially on rings/hb

 

[gracyomalley]

Thanks for the clarification. Trying to edit this to not sound like a rant - please excuse if I fail - really trying to see if competing makes any sense for DS the elder this year...

This does beg the question of why the kids like my DS should even compete this year. He doesn't really want to now that he can't repeat Level 8 or do 9, if he was super excited about it and had a team of JD to be a part of (he's the only one) I'd never ask...I'm specifically referring to the older "late starters" who were successful L8/9s last year (made regionals, for instance) but are aged out for this year...

If there is no benefit at all for them to do more then A skills...he would rather go to meets and support his team from the side, with the long shot of competing vault/floor and rings only as L10 by the end of the season - his coach and I encouraged him to do JD instead while doing the higher level skills where he can...because it seemed that the competition would be more evenly matched to his level and due to his training time limitations, but I think we were all under the incorrect impression that there would be areas he could still see some success at meets specific to his situation, some acknowledgement of the skills he can do.

Of course he could just go back to basics and clean routines - which if he LIKED competing and wanted medals might make sense - but that's not the motivator for most kids his age...

It sounds like JD would be a great level for the older/late starter/late maturer who is about a Level 6-7 kiddo (ie can get 6 skills in a routine but mostly As)...or the kid who just needs a year to mature to be back in allowable age range and has a team to be a part of at JD.

NOT TELLING DS THIS QUITE YET....

 

[skschlag]

D will be doing more than A skills in comp. Especially since he is getting ready for level 9.

 

[krc]

Hi Gracy, (happy Pirate day BTW)

That is indeed the problem going into this first year with JD. Although I'm betting that most of the older kids will have some difficulty. Not just all A routines. If DS is 16-19 he can still do L9. Most of those kids are also missing EG's or difficulty. (otherwise they'd be L10) The benefit to doing JD is that 1) can still compete and not get crushed, 2) work on getting all EG's w/o getting penalized for not having them. 3) work on adding difficulty and fine-tuning execution at the same time. Of course all kids and coaches will have to find the right path for themselves. And your specific Region may trend one way or the other. Everyone is kinda waiting to see how this all turns out. Myself included - and I have 3 boys slated for JD. In the future I can see having multiple levels for JD, similar to girls Xcel. But until acceptance reaches a critical mass, we will have to deal with this one-size-fits-all compromise.

KRC

 

[gracyomalley]

ThanksKRC - and for the irish history awareness!
DS turns 17 end of April. his coach understood that meant he had to go L10, L7 or JD. Did we miss a loophole that would allow him to do L9? He could scratch out a L9 season perhaps...

Again, I think it could morph into a great program and if he had team mates also doing JD with goals of getting to L9/10 then there would be more enthusiasm I'm sure...

 

[krc]

I'm sorry Gracy. Your coach is correct; L10, JD or L7. I was thinking he was only one age group out, L9 does stop at 16. If he was a L8/9 last year, then he already has 4EG's (if he had full sets) He could actually compete last years' routines, with only a few changes. The older boys are pretty self-aware, I'm sure he understands where he is in the spectrum of L10's. Does he want to do L10, even though he may be a bit behind? I think that the older JD's will probably have some difficulty, but not be ready to do AA. (Missing circles or giants etc.) Often the older boys just want to be with their peers. L10 can sometimes seem more like a fraternity than a sport.

KRC

 

[Jacob]

Thanks for the information everyone! Just out of curiosity, how did you find out that difficulty is not added to the scores in JD? I've been looking for that info for awhile! It seems like most information, regarding the specifics of JD, is hard to find. Everything that I've come across so far is very general.

 

[skschlag]

I found it in the compulsary JD area (division 1), but can't find anything in the text. I will look more later....