Parents Just kinda curious...

[CLgym]

DD (age 7) will compete for the first time this year, and her first meet is in a few weeks. This week, she has been coming home from practice excited to report the order she and her teammates will perform each event. Vault seems height based, but the other events seem random. (Except that coach said beam order might change, suggesting there is some rationale behind the order.) So, I've been a little curious.... Is there some strategy behind the order gymnasts perform each event???

 

[sevenatenine2]

Yes, there's strategy. In the high level team competitions like NCAA or the Olympics, you'll see your best athletes go last. With the littles, though, sometimes you want to put the kid that you KNOW won't forget their beam or floor routine first and maybe hide the weaker ones in the middle. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

 

[mom2newgymnast]

Around here, for compulsaries at least, I think the order is decided by the organizer of the meet not the coaches. And the order stays the same for each event, although the person starting will rotate. So, for example, if there are 16 athletes in a flight, on the first event #1 goes first, on the second, #4, on the third #8 and the fourth #12.

My dd is in a meet this weekend where it is obvious the order is by last name.

But I guess that is area dependent, if your coaches are determining the order. I have no idea what their strategy would be, but it's an interesting question.

 

[Gymmommy71]

Some, not all, coaches order their gymnasts in order of how they think they will score with the highest potential scorers at the end. Some will put their more consistent gymnasts at the beginning so that things like falls and major mistakes don't effect the morale of the entire team.

Vault and bars are usually done by setting though but then the other factors go into the order of those w/ the same setting.

Again, not all coaches do it this way and the scores definitely don't always work out to be the way they predicted even when they are, but it's usually an honor for a gymnast to be at the end - at least for floor and beam.

ETA - this of course is for meets where coaches determine the order - most meets around me are that way. None of it applies for when the meet sets the order .

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Yes there is a strategy and its different for different coaches. And it changes over time and from time to time.

 

[suebee]

All of dd's meets so far have been done alphabetically, although sometimes by last name and sometimes by first name.

 

[raenndrops]

Regarding Level 3 ... First Meet (this coming weekend)
For beam... we put up #1 - a girl who knows the routine, has all the skills solid, and would get nervous waiting if she saw her friends falling. Then the other girls that go on the same beam height (hiding the weaker ones in between other routines). And repeat for the higher beam height.

For bars... by setting- then follow the same rules as beam.

For Floor... #1-#4 know the routine. #1-#3 will not even attempt the BHS. #4-#7 will be spotted on the BHS. #8-#12 will have the coach out there, just in case. #13-#16 will not have a coach on the floor for their BHS.

Vault... No particular order, except those that need the extra mat on top go at the end.

 

[sce]

Regarding Level 3 ... First Meet (this coming weekend)
For beam... we put up #1 - a girl who knows the routine, has all the skills solid, and would get nervous waiting if she saw her friends falling. Then the other girls that go on the same beam height (hiding the weaker ones in between other routines). And repeat for the higher beam height.

For bars... by setting- then follow the same rules as beam.

For Floor... #1-#4 know the routine. #1-#3 will not even attempt the BHS. #4-#7 will be spotted on the BHS. #8-#12 will have the coach out there, just in case. #13-#16 will not have a coach on the floor for their BHS.

Vault... No particular order, except those that need the extra mat on top go at the end.

Thanks for the clear coach's perspective on comeptition order.
2 questions: 1) I've never heard of varying beam heights. All level 3s at our meets seem to use the same height. What's up with the different heights you mention? 2) why compete so many girls that do not have the kills (ie the list of either not doing or needing a spot on the BHS?) I mean I've seen a small number of girls that need a spot or coach standing there - over all 4 meets we've been to. Our team has one girl who has fear issues after an injury, but it's a pretty rare situation here.

 

[Gymmommy71]

I agree that I've never seen beam height changes at meets - never. You mean at the meet they change the height of the beam, or are you just talking about the different heights of beams that they use at practice but they all compete on the same height beam?

 

[sevenatenine2]

I see beam changes all the time at the lower levels.

 

[mom2newgymnast]

At my dd's meets they add or remove mats under the beam to help them mount it, depending on the girls height.

 

[profmom]

DD's gym does height by level -- the beam gets higher to accommodate bigger dismounts. I think they are at 1250 for L8.

 

[raenndrops]

Thanks for the clear coach's perspective on comeptition order.
2 questions: 1) I've never heard of varying beam heights. All level 3s at our meets seem to use the same height. What's up with the different heights you mention? 2) why compete so many girls that do not have the kills (ie the list of either not doing or needing a spot on the BHS?) I mean I've seen a small number of girls that need a spot or coach standing there - over all 4 meets we've been to. Our team has one girl who has fear issues after an injury, but it's a pretty rare situation here.

For safety reasons, little ones do not compete on the same beam height as girls who are 5 ft tall. Our L3 team has girls ranging in age from 6 to 12. The 6 year old is tiny. It would be a long fall for her to compete on the higher beam setting.

As for competing without skills, at the beginning of the season, they are allowed to be missing up to two skills in a routine. They don't do the skills for safety reasons. If they are missing more than two skills, they scratch the event. If they can compete the rest of the routine, it isn't a big deal. We have seen girls score higher without a BHS than girls on other teams that compete the BHS, but the routine isn't as tight.

 

[tooootsie]

I figured there was a reason for the order... on my girls team all the new l3 kids go first and all the repeaters go last. My youngest and oldest are often some of the last and scoring the highest on bars and floor. I was always curious if this was intentional order or not.

 

[gymdog]

You could change the height of the beam, but I don't. I do put an 8 inches under it. I don't agree that it's dangerous but then again we practice like that and I never put a kid on a high beam if their body isn't developed enough.

Regarding order, I don't really think it's a significant thing but this one of those things like nail polish that people are superstitious about. Doesn't matter what kind of logic you bring up. Basically I just set the order randomly because I don't want to hear the parents complain about it. It really doesn't matter beyond the first few competitors on the the first flight. After that, they've already judged whatever other number of routines. Why would it matter who in your flight they see first? I suppose you could argue a psychological preference, but I'm not sure. Personally I think if anything, putting your weakest up first sets the tone and makes you look bad, I'll put someone who's at least a 9.2 or something.

 

[Sasha]

I've noticed our coaches tend to favor starting with a 1 or 2 "consistently good but not the best on this event" girls, putting the lower scoring ones (or less consistent) in the middle, and finishing with the ones with the most potential to score high.

To add complexity to the topic, this strategy changes, though, when the warm-up format is the kind where they end up waiting a long time to compete (there are different warm-up formats here) after warming up on the event. In that case, coach doesn't want their highest scorers getting 'cold' and puts them in the middle.

A lot of different strategies out there!

 

[NutterButter]

When DD competed Xcel, the coaches picked the order in which the girls competed. Usually it was by anticipated score of the girl with the lower ones first and the higher scorers last. When DD competed compulsories, the lineup mostly seemed to be determined ahead of time by the meet organizer. Usually it was alpha order, reverse alpha order or by birthday. In the handful of meets where the coaches picked they usually will sandwich weaker routines in the middle. And they almost always put a confident one up on beam first (falls are contagious in my DD's group!).

 

[raenndrops]

You could change the height of the beam, but I don't. I do put an 8 inches under it. I don't agree that it's dangerous but then again we practice like that and I never put a kid on a high beam if their body isn't developed enough.

Regarding order, I don't really think it's a significant thing but this one of those things like nail polish that people are superstitious about. Doesn't matter what kind of logic you bring up. Basically I just set the order randomly because I don't want to hear the parents complain about it. It really doesn't matter beyond the first few competitors on the the first flight. After that, they've already judged whatever other number of routines. Why would it matter who in your flight they see first? I suppose you could argue a psychological preference, but I'm not sure. Personally I think if anything, putting your weakest up first sets the tone and makes you look bad, I'll put someone who's at least a 9.2 or something.

We have one L3 that NEEDS the beam high enough that her toes don't touch the mat on the mount and she has long legs... and at that height, our smallest girl can walk under the beam. An 8 inch mat still wouldn't be enough.

 

[z2akids]

At our gym, the L3 coaches seem to start with girls who are solid and and with girls who are solid. Her first L4 meet is still a month away, so I cannot even hazard a guess as to how that coach or the optionals coaches choose their order.

My DD likes to start first on beam. She tends to get nervous waiting on the other girls. She contributed to the team beam score at all but one meet last season. Her scores were generally very consistent and did not seem to matter much whether she started in the first couple or last couple.

Dd's gym does not allow the girls to compete if they won't perform a skill or if they routinely need a spot. We rarely saw a spot on floor last year at the L3 meets. The L4 coaches have already told them that they will not spot at meets either.

 

[AgingHippie]

In L3 and L4 our coaches consistently used the weakest to highest order. We had a different coach each level. I'm not sure if it's a gym policy or not. We again have a different coach this year so it will be interesting to see if this follows suit. I will say the scores didn't always work out that way though.