WAG Not reaching potential -- she should leave?

[Anna's_Mom]

I got a very upsetting email from DD's coach this morning, noting that the coaching team feels she is "not reaching her full potential" due to "lack of focus" and "excessive use of injury log" (which means not doing a full work out due to whatever injury/pain/issue is present. Their conclusion is that she should "consider whether this is the right place" for her. So, basically, you aren't doing as well as you could so please leave.

I am deeply conflicted about this. On a practical matter, not having to deal with gym would be lovely for me (and the family honestly). Of course, it's not about me, it's about her. She is 12, struggles with ADHD (gym is aware, she is medicated), and is L4 (team started 2 years ago, everyone had to start at L3). She and I know that she won't be competitive for college and may or may not be good for high school. She doesn't work as hard as she should, he is right. She has a ridiculously low pain tolerance and probably does overuse injury as an excuse. She does lose focus quickly. This is probably the first year ever that everything hasn't come easily for her and it shows at school and the gym. She hasn't ever had to work to be good before and she isn't adapting well. So, really, I can't actually argue with his observations.

But, if she loves it and I am willing to pay for it, so what if she could be better? She's not taking a spot from anyone else (that I know of -- but I am going to ask about this). There are enough girls on the team that outscore her that she isn't the make or break person for the team win. She's going to be a middle-of-the-pack finisher (Spring meets overall AA around 34.5 or so). Someone always will be. Is this a reason to deny her a spot?

So, difficult discussions and decisions this weekend -- fall team fees are due on Monday. I'm not even sure how to approach this with her or the coach.

I know this is mostly a vent, but I'm open to thoughts.

 

[munchkin3]

I feel your pain. I have a 15 yo and we now always take the 'ache and pain' of the day with a wait and see attitude.
THE VALUE IS TO KEEP YOUR PREE TEEN AROUND GOOD KIDS, IN A CLEAN ENVIRONMENT, KEEPING FIT!
If she loves it, and does not care about her progress then so what. In the end, gymnastics IS hard, and not everyone needs to be awesome. But there is a lot to be said for the kid who shows up, with a good attitude, and willing to work, but may not be the most naturally talented.....she needs to get this.....work=progress.....it gets exponentially harder with every level. She needs to work harder to keep up, and work even harder when she grows. 12 and up is time to get realistic about what she wants from gymnastics.

Now, she must respect the coaches, and their demands. If she is downright not keeping up with the class, and is lazy, then I would discuss it with your dd. perhaps a school sport would suit her better?

 

[wallflower]

Maybe you should sit down and have a discussion with her about what she wants to do.

If her committment level doesn't match what the gym is looking for, maybe you could find a program where it's a better fit. Maybe a program other than JO. She can love something, but not fit well into the gyms program.

I would think it must be a significant problem for the gym to bring it up. Do you watch practice?

Even if she isn't taking a spot from anyone, she may be a distraction to the other girls. When you have a kid who has trouble focusing or is maybe seeming like they are using injuries to get out of work, it can rub off on others.

 

[Midwestmommy]

To me, it seems odd to deliver that news/ask that question in an email. At my job we have a rule that delivering difficult news should always be done in person or at least with a phone conversation (then follow up with emails as needed). In other words, this is part of your job. Those calls/conversations that you don't want to have are the most important ones to make. The most difficult calls are the most important ones and, well, what defines people in some ways--anyone can make "easy" phone calls.

With that said, it would seem the first thing to do is ask for a meeting. It's really easy to misinterpret intentions and tone from just an email.

Are they really saying please leave.
Or are they saying if she wants to stay things need to change.
Or are they saying we need a plan to fix this and want your support?

It's hard to know intentions/tone from an email. By the way, if its the first option, them not delivering that message face to face is cowardly and unprofessional...in my opinion. This sport is about helping kids grow into responsible, caring adults--not just gymnastics.

Given her age, you might want to meet with them first, then bring her in. Also, talk to her. Does she still really love the sport or does she want to try new things?

 

[lovemygymnast]

Well, that's rough...I can't imagine why something like this couldn't have been addressed in person? Unless your daughter is a complete distraction to the other girls or causing safety issues, I can't imagine a reason for her not to be able to remain on the team. In my opinion, I think you should email or call to meet with the coach. I feel for your daughter though. Are there other gym options in your area?

 

[Anna's_Mom]

Now, she must respect the coaches, and their demands. If she is downright not keeping up with the class, and is lazy, then I would discuss it with your dd. perhaps a school sport would suit her better?

Sadly, there are no school-based sports options at the middle school level here. It seems like a 34.5 AA, which placed her 4th, couldn't be classed as "not keeping up". But I'm getting that the coach isn't willing to keep her unless she can show a significant change, so it doesn't seem like he will value a solid but not great team member. He is VERY "win" oriented, so I guess if she isn't likely to finish top 3 then he doesn't want her on the team. Which just seems wrong, but it's not my team, so I guess I don't get a vote.

 

[Ali'sMom]

Is there another gym in the area that isn't as win oriented as he is?

 

[Anna's_Mom]

To me, it seems odd to deliver that news/ask that question in an email. At my job we have a rule that delivering difficult news should always be done in person or at least with a phone conversation (then follow up with emails as needed). In other words, this is part of your job. Those calls/conversations that you don't want to have are the most important ones to make. The most difficult calls are the most important ones and, well, what defines people in some ways--anyone can make "easy" phone calls.

Yeah, this really bugged me, but to be fair I am not often actually inside the gym, so they might have been trying to catch me in person this week. What really, really made me mad is that they sent this to my parents by mistake. They are an emergency contact and who sometimes pay the fees but should never have been in the middle of this!

Good point on not really knowing what they are trying to say. I took it as "shape up or ship out". I guess my next move should probably request a private meeting to figure out what they really are trying to say, but I want to talk to DD first to see what she would like to do. It is the last week of school and she is in the middle of final exams, so this isn't a great week to do that. But there is a clear deadline of Monday -- either pay the 2015/16 fees or not.

 

[wallflower]

It might not have anything to do with scores. A kid could be scoring 38's, but if they feel like she isn't trying, is making excuses, is a negative for the dynamic of the team, they may address the issue with the parent. You need to talk to the coach to figure out what exactly they feel is the problem. Not saying any of the above is your DD, just pointing out that there are many ways to be a asset to a team just as there are many ways to be a detriment to a team.

 

[Anna's_Mom]

Is there another gym in the area that isn't as win oriented as he is?

There are Y programs that field Xcel teams but I think the other "big" gym in the area is even more competitive. I will probably call them to see what that would look like before talking to DD about options.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Ok there is another side here. You daughter is part of a team. It is not good for the team to see someone not extending the effort that they are yet get to stay on the team. I understand she has issues and it could still be a distraction for the other girls.

A classmate of my daughters is at our gym, she as ADD issues. She is not progressing at that same rate as the other girls due to her distractability. But her grandmother gets this. She doesn't move forward. And she also realizes there will be a point where she can't go forward without the effort.
And they will remove the child from the practice, when her focus is off. It is a distraction to the other girls. And also puts her at risk for injury. Our coaches are not fans of kids getting hurt on their watch.

Pretty much everyone gets tp a rubber meets the road point where its doesn't come so easy and requires more work. At they point they need to decide do the work or be done.

Seeing it at our gym. The conditioning is going up. It has to, to do the higher level skills. The kids who can't or won't do the conditioning aren't going to be around long. And the conditioning is going to get harder. My daughter had a great season. And at our team banquet, the coaches were talking about the grunt work required. How important the effort is. I was beyond proud that they recognized her effort as one of the top conditioners.

I think you and your daughter need to decide if she is ready to put in more work. If not it might be time to look at other options. If she loves gymnastics a place with a rec team.

Good luck.

 

[MILgymFAM]

Sadly, there are no school-based sports options at the middle school level here. It seems like a 34.5 AA, which placed her 4th, couldn't be classed as "not keeping up". But I'm getting that the coach isn't willing to keep her unless she can show a significant change, so it doesn't seem like he will value a solid but not great team member. He is VERY "win" oriented, so I guess if she isn't likely to finish top 3 then he doesn't want her on the team. Which just seems wrong, but it's not my team, so I guess I don't get a vote.

Well, unless they are capping team at three girls per level, then there HAS to be room for girls who do not finish top three. That is just nonsensical to me, from a business perspective- unless they have phenoms beating down the door to the gym. I would say that if she loves it still, and is able to keep up then she should be allowed to stay. My DD may very well never even make a podium in JO and she does certainly lag behind in practice, but she gives 110% and the owner of her gym has said that her effort alone will secure her spot... That's the way it should be in my opinion. I agree with the others- the email was vague and this should have been addressed in person. Do so now, as soon as you can. If they are kicking her out, please do find another gym for her that will value her for who she is. My DD was informally told that she wasn't good enough for JO by a team this year, and it was absolutely crushing for her. She actually cried for days. Tweens/young teens have pretty fragile egos, and if this is something she loves, being told she isn't good enough will hurt. If they aren't kicking her out, maybe some better communication could be had in the future.

ETA: effort doesn't look the same on everyone. My ODD would literally push herself till she puked in gym- her effort is visible and palpable. My YDD, who gives it her all also, tends to outwardly be more cavalier about gym. She just has a more laid back and giggly personality that hides how much she really cares. You know your DD best, and if she cares about gym and it isn't translating, tell the coaches. I had to have a discussion with YDDs coaches that she is actually quite competitive and beats herself up when she doesn't score well- they had no clue! If, on the other hand, your DD really doesn't care all that much and it shows, you may need to talk to her about the team aspect of the sport and putting her best efforts forward.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

she gives 110% and the owner of her my has said that her effort alone will secure her spot... .

I think that is the difference. I don't think the OPs daughter is extending the effort.

And that is not good for the team and the girls who are.

 

[mommyof1]

The coaches should definitely have made this a face-to-face conversation. Their conflict avoidance is making things much harder on you. I would schedule an in-person meeting with her coach and the relevant supervisory personnel (head coach, gym owner, team director, etc.).

But, if she loves it and I am willing to pay for it, so what if she could be better?

As a parent I totally agree with this--as long as she is actually working hard and doing her best to reach her full potential, whatever that happens to be. But you need to figure out exactly what is going on in practice from a neutral perspective. Is she distracting the other kids? Bothering them? Is her inattention creating safety issues for herself or others? If so, it's not fair to her or the other kids to keep her there. This is information the coaches should be providing to you. I would also watch a couple of practices so you can see what's going on firsthand.

If she isn't causing trouble for others but is obviously goofing off, as a parent I would still be conflicted about expending my limited resources ($$$, my time and effort getting her to practice, and my sanity) on something that my child wasn't fully committed to. I would probably issue an ultimatum: achieve some type of behavior goal related to participating fully in practice, completing conditioning assignments, etc. by a certain date, or no more gymnastics. Unfortunately this type of threat would not be easy to implement at this point in the season, but given the issues perhaps the gym would be willing to craft an agreement that you are released from the contract if she doesn't improve her effort by the end of the summer. But that's just what I personally would do because getting my kid to practice is a logistical nightmare and it's just not worth it to me unless my daughter is fully committed; your tolerance level and parenting style may vary!

It might also help to look into the available Y/XCel programs. Perhaps one of those programs would be a better fit for her goals and she would be happier and work harder there.

 

[my4buffaloes]

I think you need to set up a meeting for a couple of days from now and make sure that you watch practice between now and then. But I would not tell your dd that you are watching practice so that she does not act differently with you there. That is a tough one. There is a lot of value in her continuing gymnastics, but is there value to the gym in keeping her on the team? I would pursue the Xcel option somewhere due to her age and level honestly.

But first I would have a sit down with the coaches, a sit down with her and then a sit down together to figure this all out. One thing to remind the coaches is that you are helping them pay the bills and she did finish 4th AA at states (did I read that correctly?). They can't expect to only keep the winners on the team or they will have such a small team that they can't pay their bills. Plus things change with each level - just because Suzy won at level 4 does NOT mean she will at level 5. There are some tough conversations coming up. I hope you can figure it out.

 

[UnoMas]

You need to have an in person meeting, and find out what the real issue is. If it is really the coach's problem with scores/winning, time to move on. If it is effort and distractibility that's affecting others, and it is something that she CAN change, then a plan to address the issues. Not finishing top 3 is not a reason to quit or move on. I have 2 with ADHD, I know how hard this can be. They have their challenges for sure, but gymnastics is also 100% awesome for them in so many ways, so much more important than medals or scores.

 

[mandkmom]

I have a child who is crazy hard working. Really- she won hardest worker for her level last year. Things do not come naturally to her. But in the gym she works because she loves the sport and I've told her if she isn't working hard then we can find another sport.

So when I see a child not working hard, not putting in 100%, it is upsetting. I've watched when girls have taken coach's time because hey aren't working hard. The coach ends up spending more time talking or trying to motivate that child. And that takes time away from my child. The ratios at my gym aren't great IMO, so that time is very valuable

If your daughter loves gym then she needs to show it. I'd sit down with her and ask what she wants and go from there with a specific plan. And of course meet with the coaches.

If I got an email like that I'd think hard about what impact my child's behavior was having on the gym and her teammates. And heck- for the $ I'd be annoyed that she wasn't putting forth her best effort. This sport is expensive.

Maybe this will be a wake up call for her and she will recommit herself. Or a realization that a different program is for her.

I wish you luck. Not an easy situation

 

[duyetanh]

My kid too got hardest worker award for her group. In my opinion, it is the best award there is. She definitely isn't the most talented. And I don't care! I know it drives my kid nuts when these two girls punk around, so to speak. But i have worked out a system with her for coping, and it seems to be working well. What you need to find out is simple. Is she bothering or distracting others or is this a self issue? And what was the real motive of the email. Good luck, this stuff is never easy...

 

[anothergymmom]

You remarked that this is the first time in her life that things are not coming easily to her. Well, that happens to everyone at some point. It just happens at different times in life. its what we do in that situation that matters. I think gym could potentially be a great place to learn that hard work is what matters and that there will always come a time when something is hard. Learning to "lean in" when it gets hard is a great skill to learn, and if she can stay in gym and learn it now she will be in a great position for other life challenges. I'd try to talk to the coaches to get some clarity and to your dd about how much hard work and effort matter a lot more than scores and winning. Try to encourage her to give it her all and remind her that you don't care about scores or placements. You just want her to be able to do something she loves and to be able to take pride in her efforts. Best of luck!

 

[Pineapple_Lump]

"excessive use of injury log" (which means not doing a full work out due to whatever injury/pain/issue is present.

She has a ridiculously low pain tolerance and probably does overuse injury as an excuse.

This is very telling to me as a coach. 95% of my gymnasts do not like having to do modified activity because of injury.