WAG NY Times article about abuse at Everest

[amiandjim]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/18/sports/gymnasts-coach-abuse.html

The fat group?!?!!? Disgusting!

 

[FlippinLilysMom]

And he is still coaching. The girl that placed 3rd above Lily at the HOPES championship is at Everest gymnastics and coached by him (I believe). There were also a few other HOPES girls and junior elite girls from Everest.

 

[Flippin'A]

This makes me absolutely sick. Hearing what those girls are probably still going through...
It also illustrates how these things keep happening even when someone reports. We have a judge who actually witnessed a child being slapped and did the absolute right thing by reporting it. But because everyone is so afraid of reprisal and having scholarships taken away and losing the return on their investment, still nothing was done. How do we fix this? It's my understanding that this type of report would still go to USAG, right? Because safe sport is only handling sexual abuse? And I suspect that now that the story is in the NY times, we might see some action against him. It shouldn't take going to the media to get things to change, but that seems to be the only way to get results.

 

[RTT2]

And over and over nothing is done even when reports are filed.

 

[Sk8ermaiden]

It makes me sick. There was a thread on that Facebook group. About the way a coach was captured on video, at a major gymnastics competition, treating his gymnast. It was't physical abuse or berating, but more of his demeanor towards her. You watched it and your heart sank for her.

Within like, 4 comments the sentiment turned from "That was awful" to "He's a great coach." And "I'm sure that was just a moment of negativity and he lightened the mood on the way to vault." and "Everyone has a bad day." FROM MOMS OF GYMNASTS. It was absolutely sickening and a #1 prime example of how this has gone on for so long.

And I don't know beans about that coach. Yes, it is POSSIBLE that it wasn't what it looked like, but even after ALL we have seen and heard this year, their very first instinct was to say it probably wasn't what it looked like. Oh yes, I'm SO SURE that he's an *** on national television but behind closed doors with no oversight, he's lovely. Because that's how that works.

 

[FlippinLilysMom]

There is a mom on a facebook group who has her young daughter at this gym and she is defending him, saying she has never seen anything and he has been nothing but supportive of her daughter (who I think is a level 5 or something).

 

[amiandjim]

There is a mom on a facebook group who has her young daughter at this gym and she is defending him, saying she has never seen anything and he has been nothing but supportive of her daughter (who I think is a level 5 or something).

And perhaps that is her experience. That doesn’t mean the article isn’t true, it just means she has never witnessed anything inappropriate. Abusers can be very good at hiding their activities. And perceptions definitely vary.

This isn’t exactly the same, but my daughter was one of 34 girls on her level last year. She had an overwhelmingly positive experience. Several girls, that were not typically grouped with her at practice, had an overwhelmingly negative experience. That doesn’t mean one or the other isn’t true.

Now, would I keep my young child at this gym....no. Just like I wouldn’t have kept her at Geddert’s simply out of principle.

 

[amiandjim]

Or maybe she only sees what she wants to see. Honestly, the fact that her obviously talented 8 year-old level 5 is considered a B team kid there tells me it’s very cutthroat.

 

[Sk8ermaiden]

At our old gym, the coach had divided the girls into two groups, one with a name meant to shame them. My DD was the ONLY child to tell a parent out of a dozen girls. And even she didn't mention it for weeks. She was so used to that kind of crap from the coach that it never even occurred to her that that was wrong. Too many parents think that just because they didn't see/hear something, that it didn't happen. We ALL watched practice. We were too far away to hear though. A LOT of crap was being said that was not OK. And this was just level 2/3.

 

[Seeker]

Perhaps the reason “nothing was done” is because the allegations were unfounded or they weren’t able to discern what happened?
And how do we know nothing was done? There are several ways to address issues that arise and they all don’t end with the coach being banned. None of us are privy to that information so it’s best to not make assumptions.

Everyone has a different personal experience — even participating in the same thing, what I feel about it will be different than everyone else. A comment to me may be barely noticed and the same comment to another could be interpreted very differently. Any of us who’ve been in the gymnastics world (or any activity really) have experienced some sort of gym drama - from the kids interacting with each other and the drama that can arise from that to how the coaches interact with the gymnasts. I’ve personally witnessed people freaking out over something that I thought was no big deal. One family blew up and eventually left our former gym over something that was obviously a big deal to them, but really seemed like a normal and appropriate response by the gym to the rest of us. Point is - there are two sides to every story and multiple bits of important data to round out a story. This only presents some of the info.

 

[Seeker]

One more thing to add — the family that got upset and left our former gym will tell anyone who will listen that the former gym is abusive. I truly believe they absolutely believe that to be true, so they say it with 100% conviction. But having intimate knowledge of the situation and what actually happened (being a witness), I vehemently disagree and so do several others who were there. So, it really often is not nearly as black and white as we’d like it to be when dealing with human emotions.

 

[amiandjim]

Seeker,

While I agree with you, since as I said the perceptions of our former gym and coach varied widely, I draw the line at the slapping. That cannot be misinterpreted. It states in the article it was witnessed, and the parents of the girl are willing to come forward and say they made a mistake covering it up and denying it happened. Maybe I’m wrong, but I cannot think of a reason for these parents, whose daughter is now away at college, for coming forward and admitting this?? If anything, I would be mortified to admit such a thing, so I have a hard time thinking they are lying?

 

[Sk8ermaiden]

And slapping her so hard he left an imprint of his hand. With witnesses.

 

[coachmolly]

Perhaps the reason “nothing was done” is because the allegations were unfounded or they weren’t able to discern what happened?
And how do we know nothing was done? There are several ways to address issues that arise and they all don’t end with the coach being banned. None of us are privy to that information so it’s best to not make assumptions.

Everyone has a different personal experience — even participating in the same thing, what I feel about it will be different than everyone else. A comment to me may be barely noticed and the same comment to another could be interpreted very differently. Any of us who’ve been in the gymnastics world (or any activity really) have experienced some sort of gym drama - from the kids interacting with each other and the drama that can arise from that to how the coaches interact with the gymnasts. I’ve personally witnessed people freaking out over something that I thought was no big deal. One family blew up and eventually left our former gym over something that was obviously a big deal to them, but really seemed like a normal and appropriate response by the gym to the rest of us. Point is - there are two sides to every story and multiple bits of important data to round out a story. This only presents some of the info.

I largely agree with this, 20 athletes on a team can have 20 different experiences and while these circumstances should not be taken lightly they also should be handled without jumping to conclusions.
However, there are a few things that stand out about these allegations. First, the allegations are coming from multiple sources and different angles- gymnasts, parents, and a coach/judge without a club affiliation. So not only are these things happening in the gym and experienced/witnessed by athletes and parents, but also at meets where they are pronounced enough to draw attention of bystanders. Next, these are reports coming from high level, successful athletes. Gymnasts who have made it to level 10/elite, gotten scholarships, made National/world teams. The type of athletes who could easily say, "It was awful and I hated every minute but it worked so I guess it was okay." Not really any type of sour grapes about unfulfilled promises or a kid who isn't progressing as anticipated. Athletes and families who have reached the highest levels and are committed to the sport and likely anticipating some level of tough coaching. Not little level 5s who cry foul when Suzy is called out for cheating on her conditioning and made to repeat it while her teammates move on to their next event. Also, these are athletes who have gone on to other gyms or college programs where they experienced gymnastics at a high level in a high intensity environment and made aware that what they experienced is not how gymnastics has to be. So I think there are some very big red flags that nothing has been said or done about this.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Why are parents OK with this?

And no, I just can’t buy they didn’t know.

I have one of the most closed mouth kids on the planet. And yet I know she is having a tough time. Oh it might take time to get the details and specifics but I know when tho gs aren’t right. But then I’ve set the expectation it’s not ok to be treated like crud.

 

[amiandjim]

Someone on the Facebook group just posted she saw a female coach from Everest KICK a compulsory gymnast during warm-ups at a meet. Seriously???? How is this happening?

 

[DebraNC]

This is well known in NC, parents who say they don't know don't want to know.

 

[mom2newgymnast]

This is well known in NC, parents who say they don't know don't want to know.

What exactly is well known in NC? We are in NC, and I honestly hadn't heard anything like these accusations about Everest. And my daughter has competed against them in pretty much every meet in compulsories for the past 4 years. I don't live in the Charlotte area though, so maybe it's only well known around there..

 

[raenndrops]

This makes me absolutely sick. Hearing what those girls are probably still going through...
It also illustrates how these things keep happening even when someone reports. We have a judge who actually witnessed a child being slapped and did the absolute right thing by reporting it. But because everyone is so afraid of reprisal and having scholarships taken away and losing the return on their investment, still nothing was done. How do we fix this? It's my understanding that this type of report would still go to USAG, right? Because safe sport is only handling sexual abuse? And I suspect that now that the story is in the NY times, we might see some action against him. It shouldn't take going to the media to get things to change, but that seems to be the only way to get results.

According to the article, USAG passed the report on to SafeSport... and based on the commercials during Championships, SafeSport does handle physical and emotional abuse too???

How we fix it is by being willing to accept 3rd party witness reports without expecting MINORS who witnessed the same thing to necessarily come forth AND still being willing to INVESTIGATE the claim.
It the case of the slap, it would have helped if the parents hadnt originally been willing to write a letter claiming it never happened. NOT MY OPINION, but... Them coming forward now, in a court of law, they would be deemed not credible because they either lied then or are lying now - either way, they are "liars."

It would probably also help if a gymnast changing gyms while being recruited wasn't looked at as a red flag to college coaches.

 

[DebraNC]

What exactly is well known in NC? We are in NC, and I honestly hadn't heard anything like these accusations about Everest. And my daughter has competed against them in pretty much every meet in compulsories for the past 4 years. I don't live in the Charlotte area though, so maybe it's only well known around there..

I was referring to parents of gymnasts at Everest. We've had families from that gym end up at our gym (mostly through relocation) as well as some interactions with elite athletes from that gym. They have a very harsh reputation at least in our neck of the woods.