WAG Preferred hand placement for BHS on beam

[nevertooold]

Coaches, what is your preferred hand placement for BHS on beam and if the gymnast seems inclined to a different placement do you allow?

 

[kandkfunk]

I have wondered this as well. Great question. My daughter's coach is very particular about how the girls hold their hands. I think their hand placement looks awkward, but most girls are able to do it. My daughter's coach makes them keep their hands together so that one hand fits in the space between the thumb and pointer finger of the other hand. Sort of hard to explain. She requires this hand placement.

 

[nevertooold]

Dominant hand in front or opposite hand in front?

 

[fliptwisttwirl]

My coach teaches it the same..dominate hand in front. We have a few girls that do it differently though..he'd rather them feel comfortable with how they're doing it then try to change it to his way.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

back walkover hands 1st.

step out right/left hand forward 2nd

step out left/right hand forward 3rd

whatever works...4th

 

[PalmTree]

I used to do back handsprings on beam with my hands ON TOP of each other because that was the only way I could manage. Now I make sure to teach correct hand positions early on and the kids do it fine. I teach back walkover hands, like kandk is explaining.

 

[nevertooold]

@dunno
Bwo hands as in hands side by side thumbs together on top of the beam? For BHS? Or do you do BWO hands in a differnt position?

 

[Deleted member D3987]

side by side and thumbs together on top of the beam. remember, if they do back walkovers this way they are flexible enough for BHS the same way.

 

[nevertooold]

@dunno
Thats how I learned it back it the day, but have heard opinions in more recent years that that position was easier for hands to slip and that positions w more palm on the beam were favorable.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

like i said, if the flexibility is there it's not a problem.

 

[gymdog]

I don't recommend the advice above at all! Slipping isn't even my primary concern, acceleration and "push" off the beam is. Understand the placement above would minimize wrist impact but I don't think it's worth it. Just think about how your hands would have to be on the beam to push off it most effectively and you'll be close to your answer. Recommend non-dominant hand in front, hands straight as possible. Some girls do get very close to the side by side placement when they have an extremely fast and proficient BHS, but that's not just flexibility, it's fast twitch muscle also. Not many people are cranking BHS on beam like Shawn Johnson, let's be realistic here.

They should do handstands for a long time in this hand position. Hand Positions for Back Handspring on Beam - Kellie Mizoguchi - YouTube Kellie Mizoguchi's argument (hands forward is the most STABLE).

 

[nevertooold]

@gymdog, thanks for the link, and that is what teach, just curious to what others were doing as I was talking to another coach who prefers a different placement.

 

[chalkbowl]

We have started doing more work with their non-dominant hand in front. Meaning if they step out with their left foot first, they have their right hand in front. That being said when the girls start doing the actual BHS, if they are inclined to do their dominant hand in front I allow it. My girls who have non-dominant hand in front have a MUCH more consistent BHS. I have never ever taught a BHS with BWO hands...never seemed safe in the least...

 

[Gymmommy71]

My DD does hers w/ backwalkover hands...each hand is grasped on the beam w/ the thumb on one side and the rest of the fingers on the other...and the hands are together so that the thumb of her one hand is pretty much touching the pinky finger of her other hand... Her BHS looks like a really fast backwalkover...they look like this on the floor too...she has very flexible shoulders...

 

[LizzieLac]

I don't recommend the advice above at all! Slipping isn't even my primary concern, acceleration and "push" off the beam is. Understand the placement above would minimize wrist impact but I don't think it's worth it. Just think about how your hands would have to be on the beam to push off it most effectively and you'll be close to your answer. Recommend non-dominant hand in front, hands straight as possible. Some girls do get very close to the side by side placement when they have an extremely fast and proficient BHS, but that's not just flexibility, it's fast twitch muscle also. Not many people are cranking BHS on beam like Shawn Johnson, let's be realistic here.

They should do handstands for a long time in this hand position. Hand Positions for Back Handspring on Beam - Kellie Mizoguchi - YouTube Kellie Mizoguchi's argument (hands forward is the most STABLE).

This is the way DD is learing it now. In fact, she is being taught to do her BWO with the same hands in preparation for the BHS (was doing BWO with hands side-by-side). Coach believes it gives the best support for the pushing off needed in the BHS.

This is a very interesting discussion - thanks!

 

[coachmolly]

Good discussion. I have a kid who is working bhs (taught to her by another coach) and they scare the bejeebies out of me. Looks like we might be working on some hand placement drills next practice.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

I don't recommend the advice above at all! Slipping isn't even my primary concern, acceleration and "push" off the beam is. Understand the placement above would minimize wrist impact but I don't think it's worth it. Just think about how your hands would have to be on the beam to push off it most effectively and you'll be close to your answer. Recommend non-dominant hand in front, hands straight as possible. Some girls do get very close to the side by side placement when they have an extremely fast and proficient BHS, but that's not just flexibility, it's fast twitch muscle also. Not many people are cranking BHS on beam like Shawn Johnson, let's be realistic here.

They should do handstands for a long time in this hand position. Hand Positions for Back Handspring on Beam - Kellie Mizoguchi - YouTube Kellie Mizoguchi's argument (hands forward is the most STABLE).

Kellie is a good coach but not the end all to this issue. some of this issue is based in bio-mechanics. they can't be argued. so then, if the gymnast has good flexibility and good external rotation and strength thru the shoulders, thumbs together and wrist pads on the top of the beam gives the best "base" support and one that is symmetrical. yes, a hand can slip. why? because they threw crooked to begin with. cause and effect. as i said, not all kids will be physically able to use this technique. but i can assure you, this technique has been used for years and for skills like lay lay and so forth. and slipping a hand can happen when they have one hand in front of the other. the root cause of hand slipping is due to the athlete throwing crooked, sitting crooked, etc; this is all a part of beam and issues that coaches deal with on a daily basis.

the next part of the equation of this issue is which hand is forward depending on which foot they step out. if one hand is front of the other, the handstand phase or support/base phase is crooked. there is nothing you can do about symmetry when one hand is in front of the other. you can't argue this. it's crooked and it is what it is and can't be changed. it's impossible to hold a handstand with 1 hand in front of the other without imbalance. when momentum and force are placed on the imbalance it makes it even more difficult for the athlete to keep things "straight" so to speak. i mean...that is the goal right? straight and aligned.

so then, how or what is the best way to mitigate the crooked support? keep the hands as close to each other as possible and then have the opposite hand forward of the foot that steps out. so, if the gymnast steps out with her right foot first it will be easier or more effective if the left hand is forward. when you step out right and have the right hand forward this causes the left hip and left shoulder to open slightly. this then causes the gymnast to fall off their right side of the beam. it also causes their right foot to slip off the right side of the beam on the landing of the layout and they then crotch the beam.. this can be countered by having the left hand forward. the Chinese are firm believers in this method. but anthropometrically speaking, they can do things other cultures can not because of their body types. this would be one of those things that are easier for them to do due to their body type and shoulder widths and unnatural things they can do with their shoulders. this is why they lead the pack in skills like inverts, ono's and such. and no one can argue with their near flawless technique on balance beam.

so then, you start early on with techniques that are born in bio-mechanics. as they age and develop, these techniques may no longer work. you then are left with using "whatever works". or whatever techniques minimize falling ratios.

 

[AmandaLynn]

Just for fun...

From the Event Finals on beam in the 2012 Olympic Games.

Gymnast Name/Stepout leg/"lead" hand

Linlin - Left/Right
Lu - Left/Right
Raisman - Right/Left *Does a bhs to 2 feet, but right is the forward foot on landing*
Ponor - Left/Right
Afanaseva - Right/Right
Iordache - Right/Left
Douglas - Left/Left
Komova - Right/Right

 

[mimi]

Bear with me...the step out leg is the one that is forward, right?

 

[Deleted member D3987]

well, usually if the right foot is in front at the start the right foot steps out/down on the beam.