Sorry for repeating this topic: implications of the proposed 2013 JO changes

[LizzieLac]

Ok, I am sorry to start another thread on this topic, but the change starting the 2013 competition year is confusing. My DD who just finished a reasonably strong level 5 year (high 8s for vault and bars, 9+ for beam and floor) is training for level 6. Of course, she has to get several skills to be able to compete level 6 - the tough ones seem to be back tuck on floor and back walkover on beam. While she is challenged right now on these couple of things I really don't see any reason she won't get them by the fall, when the final move-up decision is made.

That being said, yesterday she asks what if she has to repeat level 5 this coming season. When the new requirements take effect the following year and level 5 is like our current level 6, will she essentially have to be a level 5 again?

I don't see how they are going to get the kids to understand is is not like being held back in school. Also, if she is currenlty on a path where she needs to do one level per season to allow a couple years as a 10 (assuming this plays out as she wants) in order to make a college teamm, isn't this new system going to make it harder for girls already in these mid-levels to get to 10?

Can someone describe to me how this is supposed to work. My DD is already worrying...

Thanks!

 

[Azgymmiemom]

I really don't think this is going to be that difficult for the kids. Your dd knows what skill set she is competing. Don't think of it as being a level 5 "again"...She would be a "new" level 5.

 

[GymBee97]

Tell your DD its just a number and not to worry about it - at L5 she is just starting out and there is a long way to go before she gets to L10 and College. A lot can happen between now and then. focus on the skills learned instead of the number of the level. what skills would a college be looking for that is more important than what number they are putting on a level.

I remember when my son started out in gymnastics they Had classes instead of levels and went from Class 10 as the lowest level to class 1 as the highest level. Then about 2 years into it USAG decided to re number the levels like the girls so now L1 was the lowest and L10 is the highest. So he started at Class 7 (like L4) and when they changed it he moved into L5,

forget about the numbers they put on levels focus on the skills - what difference does it make what they call the level.

Heck in 5 years USAG might redo it all again with someother type of naming system you never know.

Just tell your DD not to worry and relax if there is an issue the coach will deal with it and yes she will do the New L5 which is the old L6 its just a name for a level

 

[wallflower]

I agree with the other posters. Kids should be able to understand that they are doing new skills, they will have a new floor routine etc.

I wouldn't worry about it slowing down the path to level 10. First because it's really far away and there's no sense in worrying yet. Second because as I understand it there is now a new level stuck between 8 and 9. Sort of an 8b. While many girls under the old levels would end up repeating level 8 because of the jump between 8 and 9, they will now have an easier time moving between 8 and 9. In theory of course

 

[MeetDirector]

Like the two previous posters said, the gymnasts get it; it's mainly the parents that are freaking out. Just go with it.

USAG is attempting to ease the transition to the higher optional levels. In order to do so, they decided that a "level" needed to be inserted before the current level 9 that leads into the bigger skills trained at level 9. In order to do this and stick with some form of sensical numbering system, they called the new level "8" (since it comes before "9") and consequently had to bump all prior levels down one number. Now, at the same time they were doing this they took the opportunity to restructure each level a little bit where needed. All of this with the end goal of easing the transitions to higher levels as girls go through the system.

I can tell you from watching our gym, that the current jump from 8 to 9 is HUGE, primarily on beam, bars, and vault. This new level will maybe keep girls around longer and lead to more success at the optional levels. It will take time for everyone to make the transition; it always does. But the athletes won't be the ones trying to figure it out.

Good Luck!

 

[LizzieLac]

Like the two previous posters said, the gymnasts get it; it's mainly the parents that are freaking out. Just go with it.

I am not one of the parents freaking out. DD was the one who was not happy with the idea that she could potentially be at "level 5" for 3 seasons. And she worries about progressing to level 10. I don't worry because I tend not to worry about things I can't control. I told her that she simply needed to work hard, stay focused, and believe in herself. However, I can see how having that label could be perceived negatively.

As far as long term, reaching level 10, yes, I know there are so many unknowns but my question is if people think the new system will slow kids down from reaching level 10. For my DD this is important factor, as she was a late starter and doesn't have as many years to get there.

 

[gymgal]

Also remember that they have not determined what the new levels will be called. We ate just referring to them as the numbers because it is easier right now but there is talk that.the will have different names that are more descriptive: beginner/interemediate/advanced compulsory

As for college, the others are right, often girls spend at least one year repeating at the optional levels so this new added level might just replace that repeat. It gives more time for uptraining, if the gyms do it correctly. I do agree that most colleges will still want to see at least 2 years of L10 if you looking ay D1 scholarships.

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[MeetDirector]

Lizzielac - didn't mean to imply you were freaking out - that is just a generic term.

And yes, they will use numbers for the levels. Just as today, those levels will also have names. Most people, just like today, won't refer to the names - just the numbers.

 

[Aussie_coach]

She won't be " repeating " level 5. As you and others have stated the new level 5 will be the old level 6. So if she was repeating level 5 she would be doing the new level 5.

Even young kids are old enough to understand that the system has changed, you can explain that she is moving up to the old level 5 to the harder new level 5. She will get it because she will bring and competing the harder skills.

 

[Natasha]

As far as reaching L10 in the same amount of time....explain to your dd that L10 is still L10 with the same requirements and skills. All USAG is doing is adding a "stepping stone" in between L8 and L9 to make that transition easier. Since many many girls end up doing 2 years of L8, they will now get to "step up." Really, other than all the numbers changing, it will be like having an 8 1/2 level. For those girls that are strong enough to not need that step, they could theoretically score out of L8 and go to L9 as it is not like learning a whole new routine, but rather it can be a matter of substituting the skills into the same routine. There are still the same number of compulsory levels until you get to optionals, and once you get to optionals, it is a whole different thing. Rather than focus on the #s, it may be easier to think of it as "one more compulsory level until optionals."

 

[gymgal]

Even young kids are old enough to understand that the system has changed, you can explain that she is moving up to the old level 5 to the harder new level 5. She will get it because she will bring and competing the harder skills.

For the average gymnast who is going year to year ("maybe I'll try out for Cheer next season" type of girl) and doesn't really have dreams of going competing in college or elite (realistic or not), this may be true, but for the rest, it does factor into their plans. They view it as still being at L5 and still having 6 more years to L10. Yes, they get that they are doing harder skills but it doesn't help them get to L10 any sooner. Well, the reality is that maybe it will, as I mentioned earlier that this new level may decrease the amount of repeats in the upper levels but when you're in L5 and you're thinking you're going to do 1 level a year, you don't have that mindset.

To the original poster - I think only time will tell as to how gyms will handle the new requirements. You may see more gyms scoring out of certain levels for the girls who are already in the system. Just as L6 seems to be the level a lot of gymnasts score out, we may find this happening in L5. And it appears that L6 and 7 may be slightly easier than the currently L7 and 8 (not as many B skills) so this may a possibility. But until the requirements are sets, gyms can't do much of anything concrete in the way of planning for the upper levels.

 

[LizzieLac]

For the average gymnast who is going year to year ("maybe I'll try out for Cheer next season" type of girl) and doesn't really have dreams of going competing in college or elite (realistic or not), this may be true, but for the rest, it does factor into their plans. They view it as still being at L5 and still having 6 more years to L10. Yes, they get that they are doing harder skills but it doesn't help them get to L10 any sooner. Well, the reality is that maybe it will, as I mentioned earlier that this new level may decrease the amount of repeats in the upper levels but when you're in L5 and you're thinking you're going to do 1 level a year, you don't have that mindset.

To the original poster - I think only time will tell as to how gyms will handle the new requirements. You may see more gyms scoring out of certain levels for the girls who are already in the system. Just as L6 seems to be the level a lot of gymnasts score out, we may find this happening in L5. And it appears that L6 and 7 may be slightly easier than the currently L7 and 8 (not as many B skills) so this may a possibility. But until the requirements are sets, gyms can't do much of anything concrete in the way of planning for the upper levels.

Exactly - this is just how the kids think. And quite frankly, it is how many parents think - this is evidenced by the numerous topics on these boards about "not moving up" and "repeating a level." We all understand why these things happen and that often it is in the gymmies best interest, but emotionally the child and the parent see other kids moving forward without them.

So, when we already measure success to a certain extent by saying "my DD successfully completed level 5" and the ultimate end-game is level 10, you must admit that trying to tell your DD that doing level 5 for 3 years is not a big deal because there are new skills is going to be all about the "spin" you put on it. And, I would think unless gyms take a scoring out approach, getting to level 10 is going to take longer for those kids.

I just see this as potentially problematic, as a demotivator.

 

[AmandaLynn]

I'm not sure I understand what your proposed solution is. The levels will change in 2013. That is something that is defninitely going to happen. The truth of the matter is that not every gymnast will reach level 10. And that's okay.

I'm not saying that your daughter won't reach L10. I don't know her and I can not predict the future. But honestly, take a look at the number of L5s vs the number of L10s.

I guess my advice is to just enjoy the ride and try not to focus on level/score so much.

 

[GymBee97]

AmandaLynn that is what I believe too. enjoy the ride and try to keep your DD's focus on this year.

What I have seen is L4 and L5 have lots of kids in them. L6 you loose about 1/2 the kids. L7 you lose 1/2 of those that came from L6. And each year one or two quit after that. In my area most of the L9 and L10 kids at any gym I know of are a group of 2 or 3 kids as compared to the maybe 15 - 20 kid you see at a gym at L4 and L5.

Alot of kids leave too in L7 and L8 because of injuries that make them have to quit. I don't think I've ever seen a kid make it to optionals that didn't do at least 2 years at L7 and/or L8. I think this new level to make the transition to L9 is actually a good thing and may make the move up more doable without having to do 2 - 3 years at L8 getting stuck trying to make that huge leap to L9.

I'm sure in other areas of the country it may be different.

I'm not sure I understand what your proposed solution is. The levels will change in 2013. That is something that is defninitely going to happen. The truth of the matter is that not every gymnast will reach level 10. And that's okay.

I'm not saying that your daughter won't reach L10. I don't know her and I can not predict the future. But honestly, take a look at the number of L5s vs the number of L10s.

I guess my advice is to just enjoy the ride and try not to focus on level/score so much.

 

[gymislife]

Gymbee97 great post. I as a head optional coach is having parents ask me to score their child out so they don't have to repeat level 5 or 6. I first educate them and explain to the exactly what was said in previous messages. The transition from 8 to 9 is very large and that can be a bigger demotorvator than just taking the proper steps to progress effectively. PARENTS the levels are just numbers its the content of the routine that matters. It's a progression that must take place besides USAG could just add a 5 1/2 or 6 1/2 level would that make you feel better?? Lol. Either way it still going to take time to get to level 10 regardless of new changes or not. Also, one respondent talked about possible doing Elite ummm your DD should be in that process now.

 

[LizzieLac]

PARENTS the levels are just numbers its the content of the routine that matters. It's a progression that must take place besides USAG could just add a 5 1/2 or 6 1/2 level would that make you feel better?? Lol. Either way it still going to take time to get to level 10 regardless of new changes or not.

Again, as a parent I am not having trouble with this. I understand that it is simply a different way of organizing the skills and progrssion to get to level 10. The when and what you call it is not really important because for almost everyone it takes a number of years to get there. It is my DD that pointed that with this change someone could be at level 5 for 3 years and isn't that a demotivator.

These kids are smart and think these things through. And sometimes they are emotional. Forget how to manage the parents. How do you manage the child who thinks you just added obstacles to her meeting her goals? It is not as simple as you make it sound. That's all.

 

[gymgal]

Also, one respondent talked about possible doing Elite ummm your DD should be in that process now.

Just for the record, I was the one who mentioned elite, but it wasn't in reference to the OP's dd -or mine. It was a general statement about young gymnasts having large longterm goals. And as I said - realistic or not, they are their goals (again, a general statement). But I disagree that one would have to be in the elite track already at level 5 or at 9yrs old to make elite. Yes, most gyms select the talent young but there are girls who start late or go just one level a year and make elite. Sometimes a girl's dream is just to make it through trials just to say they did it, and not necessarily compete elite. There's nothing wrong with that....

Now, back on topic - The reality is that there are going to be some upset girls and upset parents. And coaches are going to have to be ready for this. There are plenty of girls who have gone from 5 to 10 without needing to repeat. Now they have added another level to the mix. There are going to be parents/gymnasts who feel if the others did it in 6 levels, why I have to go through 7 levels? It is the same as with school. If schools decided to change the requirements so that there was an added grade, but no additional skills were being taught, parents would be furious.

I personally am not worried about it - just more curious how it will lay out.


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[Granny Smith]

In regards to going through in 7 as opposed to 6 levels, there is still the option to score out. The purpose of the added level is to try to keep as many girls as possible still in the sport and progressing through the levels. There will still be standout girls who can score out and move up, just like there is in the current levels. If a gymnast goes through the levels every yr without repeating at some point they would probably be doing multiple years of 10, so possibly instead of doing 3 or 4 yrs of 10, they would do 2 or 3. It is still possible to do the levels without repeating, but many tend to lose sight that unless you are planning to go elite, the last level is 10 and if you get there you stay there (unless you plan to go elite), multiple years or repeating 10 over and over.

 

[GymBee97]

Gymgal your right on target. It is what it is and plans need to change to meet the changes in the program. The fact is you have to have the skils for the level to compete the level no matter what they call it. This is one of those "you never know what will happen in the future" moments. We plan one thing then the rules change, or we don't have the skills needed and we have to adjust. Just part of the sport.

 

[B&M's mom]

Honestly, I think if it is explained clearly to the girls, they'll get it. My youngest is training Level 5 this summer. She already knows that the levels will be restructured and renumbered next year and that she'll likely do Level 5 again but with different skills. She's 9 and wants to make it to the Olympics (not going to happen). She's not upset and frankly tends to focus on what skills she needs to get rather than the level number.

As the parent of another child training pre-elite and Level 10 (oldest daughter) I can see why USAG is doing this. The leap between some of these levels was huge. I was surprised at the skill upgrades between level 8 and 9. My oldest daughter most likely won't be impacted by the changes but I'm glad that USAG is implementing them. (Oh, and yes, you can enter the elite track later(well relatively speaking) my daughter didn't enter it until she was 10 and training Level 9. Time will tell if she actually qualifies).