WAG 8th grade Verbal recruit

[lhmom]

Does anyone have stats on how many verbal commitments have actually signed with their colleges? I was wondering because the gymnast at DD's gym who got a full scholarship to a Division 1 school did not decide on this college until last summer. Her friend from another gym just signed with another Division 1 school this summer (unsure whether she was offered a scholarship though). I will say that the gymnast from DD's gym did compete at Nationals all 3 of her level 10 years which helped her get noticed, I am sure.

 

[Midwestmommy]

"life is not fair" is not an acceptable reason for me to not care about the health and welfare of children involved in this sport. These 5 to 12 year olds are children. That matters in the U.S., at least it's supposed to, Recruiting 13 year olds impacts children in this sport. I care. We all should.

 

[cbifoja]

Does anyone have stats on how many verbal commitments have actually signed with their colleges?

Yes! This statistic would be very interesting and might help sway my opinion one way or the other.

 

[Dka]

I am a coach of high level athletes in a different sport. I have spoken to numerous college coaches and the game has changed. Kids are giving verbals in all sports, but I have been told that if they get hurt etc or if something changes, the offer is off the table. Some of my athletes made their verbals in their sophomore or junior year, for a few it did not work out the way they thought it would. I liked it better in the past when they went on their five official visits their senior year and then made up their mind..... It's too much too young

 

[profmom]

My impression is that the verbals are as valuable and binding on both parties as the paper they're written . . . oh yeah.

 

[Midwestmommy]

Here are some more statistics I would like to see. If we are going to "professionalize" this sport starting at age 6 in the US--requiring home school, no other outside activities, require kids to be in the gym 20+ hours a week, ban kids over a certain age from being considered for competition track, assigning NCAA scholarships before eighth grade (and therefore requiring top peak performance level by age 13):

1. List of clubs that won't let you in their "fast track" program (that being the one which would put kids on track for having some chance at Division 1), unless you:

Home or online school kids aged 5-7
Home or online school kids aged 7-9
Home or online school kids aged 10-12


Of those kids who met this requirement before age 10, what percentage competed at the Olympics? What percentage will stay in the sport and got Division 1 scholarships?

Provide data for 10 years ago and today for comparison.


2. Statistics about number of injuries compared to 5 other sports for girls, grouped by seriousness of injury, dollars paid, who paid for these injuries (employer self-funded plan, employer insurance plan, individual insurance policy, Medicaid).

5-7
7-9
10-12
13-14
15-17
18+

3. How many kids are spending 15-21 or 22+ hours in the gym in these age groups:

5-7
7-9
10-12
13-14
15-17
18+

4. Of those listed in 3 above, how many had either serious acute or chronic injuries before age 15 causing them to leave the sport?


Of course, this is tongue and cheek. These statistics are not available.

But it would appear the crazies are driving the bus when girls not even entering 8th grade are being offered Division 1 scholarship spots. If people in this sport aren't able to steer the bus, then I suppose eventually someone else will have to step in to force them to stay on the road. As a society in the United States, we do have some standards left (I think).

Stricter recruiting rules, sanctions and fines would appear to be the only way to make it happen.

By the way, parents and kids currently in the recruiting process have the most to lose and of course are not going to turn down a scholarship spot to make a point, I wouldn't. They aren't the ones to fix it.

 

[Midwestmommy]

Just curious, anyone know how many ice hockey female skaters going into 8th grade this fall are committed to NCAA Division I programs and offered a scholarship right now? How many goalies?

 

[Midwestmommy]

Just did an informal search, and best I could tell there are no eighth grade commits in hockey. I found one male verbal commit going into 9th grade. I also tried to check some other sports, and while there are verbal committments in all sports, they are mostly tenth graders.

It would appear gymnastics is on the cutting edge, leading the trend of recruiting middle school children! Why? Of any sport, how a 7th grader performs is probably not a very good predicter of how they healthy they will be, how their gymnastics will have changed by 12th grade. It's club owners and college coaches doing this, apparently the only way it will be stopped is for the NCAA to force them to stop. 10th and 11th graders competing at Nationals should be ignored because all the scholarships were gobbled up 2 years previously, let's not get to that point folks. Stop the madness, this is just, well, dumb. I also don't have a dog in the fight at this moment.....just dumbfounded at how as a privately controlled sport people are letting this happen. Power without checks and controls corrupts.... History proves it in small ways and large ways all day every day...

 

[Ali'sMom]

I took the SAT as part of a gifted program at my school (we got to take the SAT in 7th and 8th AND we got to go to Summer School after 5th -8th... that was it!). In 7th grade, we had to reschedule our SAT due to weather and the rescheduled test was in a big cafeteria. Had the high schoolers believing that our school just had a bunch of geniuses getting ready for college at 12-13 (which was unheard of way back then). It was hilarious until our Guidance Counselor ruined it .

I could have written that post! LOL! Other than the weather rescheduling. As nervous as we were, we all tried to make it look like we really belonged taking the test with the juniors and seniors, until it was said "All of you taking this for the talent search, please sit over here".

I did it through Johns Hopkins - didn't help, as the program I qualified for was way too much money for my family, but I was quite proud of my scores!
Our area does it through Duke University, and I've already gotten wind of the cost of the program at Duke if the child qualifies... Now I'm just hoping that if my daughter does make it, that we can send her.... we'll see...

 

[happychaos]

I cannot be the only one that sees several of these posts as "bashing" and heavily critical of this young gymnast. And honestly, I also hear a lot of jealousy, negativity and this-process-isn't-fair beneath the facts. "we have girls in our gym age 7-8 who are competing level 8 with same level of skills as her", "We have girls in our gym who are the same age, made it to easterns/nationals and they aren't being looked at", "we can't assume she will graduate early until she actually does". Really go back and read some the posts. The tone is "why does she get to commit so young and ours don't" "She obviously isn't as good as SO many others out there" "there is no way she will be able to pull this off". Life (and particularly gymnastics) isn't fair. Get over it. From the tone of these posts, I truly get the feeling that many will be watching this girl (and others like her) just waiting for it all to fall apart so you can say - "see? we were right". The Coaches at UTAH saw something in this girl that they thought would benefit their program. Are there other girls that have a better track record, more skills, at this point in their career? sure. But they chose her. There will always be girls who are better, more skilled, older, etc than what a college has chosen as a recruit. Stop trying to figure out the reasoning. You will go crazy. Just be happy for this girl and wish her the best.

That being said, at the same time we absolutely should be discussing how we can affect a change in NCAA policy in regards to recruiting so young. And honestly, I think it needs to go the route of what is best for the athlete - picking a school so young, having to train at such a high level at such a young age just to get noticed and then risking major injury during the 5+ years of high intensity training.

For a family with a similarly (or better) skilled child, you had better believe that figuring out this scholarship game is important. Seriously, there could be $150K of scholarship money on the table (not to mention the opportunity to progress in the sport they love). Plus the implications of recruiting 8th graders...

You said something key..."Utah SAW something in this girl...." Well, how exactly did they SEE it? She is a first year L9, and did not even make Easterns. And she lives on the other side of the country. Were the coaches in her gym looking at another girl? Did her coaches and parents just do one heck of a marketing job? Was it attending Utah's camp that got her noticed? Her website? The answers to these questions ARE important, and asking the questions doesn't mean that I am jealous or that I hope that Hunter fails.

 

[cbifoja]

How many informal checks did you do?

 

[Midwestmommy]

Just three sports. Seems like the commitment lists for boys are a little easier to find online than girls.... Or maybe I'm just bad at googling (definite possibility)...

 

[mpkbt]

"we can't assume she will graduate early until she actually does". Really go back and read some the posts. The tone is "why does she get to commit so young and ours don't"

That is not bashing it is fact. What you don't seem to understand is that many people that are responding here have ALREADY been through the process and are offering very real possibilities of problems with early recruiting. This girl is the tangible example of all of these possibilities. We are parents and contrary to your OPINION we are not hoping that she fails. NO one said that.
My final word on the subject is the U did not publish the commitment, the family did......If they didn't want it talked about they didn't have to publish it. Until the put it out there it was a private conversation between the family and the U. They were proud of their daughter for committing early and needed to brag. They should not be surprised with it being discussed. This is not the only site it is being talked about. If you think this is bashing....stay off the internet.

 

[Tbrov]

By the way, parents and kids currently in the recruiting process have the most to lose and of course are not going to turn down a scholarship spot to make a point, I wouldn't. They aren't the ones to fix it.

Thanks for saying this. It is really a tough place to be, as a parent. You want to say, leave my kid alone, she's too young, and then the promises are made to others, and you may have missed your chance. This particular situation is case in point; my dd is class of 2018, Utah had been recruiting her, we said she's too young this year, now does this mean they are no longer interested; have they already verbally committed all their 2018 spaces? I get the feeling it hasn't always been like this - that it's getting worse - and any pressure we as parents can apply to NCAA and college coaches to "follow the rules" would be so great.

 

[gymgal]

Just because life and gymnastics isn't fair doesn't mean that people should just sit back and accept things that could and maybe should be improved. Life isn't fair is about the lamest excuse of the century.

Never said we should sit back. I specifically said that we should work to change the NCAA rules. The life isn't fair refers to the subjectivity of the sport and life. Coaches, employers, colleges, businesses have their preferences as to who they want. The only thing you can do is to market yourself the best you can and find the situation right for you.

And comparing something as egregious and illegal and immoral as abuse to something like picking one athlete over another because it's right for their program is ridiculous.

 

[NYG]

A verbal committment is not binding to the school or the athlete. The committment doesn't happen until an ahtlete signs a letter of intent (LOI). This is especially true in revenue generating sports (not sure for olympic), but kids with verbal committments, get "flipped" to other schools all the time. Though once that LOI is signed by an athlete and that athlete changes his mind, he would need to be released from the school to play anywhere else or drop down to a different level of competetion ie NAIA vs FCS.

 

[gymgal]

Does anyone have stats on how many verbal commitments have actually signed with their colleges? I was wondering because the gymnast at DD's gym who got a full scholarship to a Division 1 school did not decide on this college until last summer. Her friend from another gym just signed with another Division 1 school this summer (unsure whether she was offered a scholarship though). I will say that the gymnast from DD's gym did compete at Nationals all 3 of her level 10 years which helped her get noticed, I am sure.

I don't know but that would be a good stat to have, with breakdowns based on the grade they were in when they committed

 

[NYG]

Just to add, I'm fairly certain, though I could be wrong, you can't sign an LOI until your senior year. So all those kids with verbals to where ever are fair game to still be recruited by other Univiersities.

 

[gymgal]

"life is not fair" is not an acceptable reason for me to not care about the health and welfare of children involved in this sport. These 5 to 12 year olds are children. That matters in the U.S., at least it's supposed to, Recruiting 13 year olds impacts children in this sport. I care. We all should.

. Totally agree and sais that in my post. We need to address the practice if recruiting young - period. The worthiness of actual gymnasts does not need to be part of the discussion. If we are concerned about recruiting 13 yr olds, then it shouldn't matter if that 13 yr old has earned that spot because she is an elite or that she hasn't earned it because she is a first year level 10

 

[Tbrov]

Question regarding the verbal commitments: At Nationals, you get a sticker on your number; blue for Freshman, red for Sophomore, etc. If you're not yet in high school, no sticker. If you're "taken", no sticker. This to aid the colleges in knowing who is still available. So, if you've made a verbal commitment, do you have a sticker or not? Do you appear as "available" at Nationals, or not?