Parents Cute points??? Do they exist?

[cadybearsmommy]

It seems to be kind of running joke among gym moms that some kids are awarded a tad extra points (or rather a little less deductions) for being cute? Is this really a thing? I won't even pretend to understand gymnastics scoring but I will say that I've noticed that if dd (turns 10 this month but tall for her age) is going up against a lot of younger or smaller/more petite girls she doesn't do as well as she does if she is in an age group with girls more around her age and height range. Then I overheard some talk about "cute points" at a meet and wondered if anyone has experienced this? I have even heard people saying they put their girls in pigtail buns or a younger looking hairstyle to try to work this advantage. It seems a little silly and it's entirely possible that these girls who are being awarded the higher points are simply performing better, but was just curious if it does happen sometimes? Judges are only human, and I have judged other events before (not gymnastics) and I'm sure my overall mood/level of energy that day, etc probably comes into play with scoring sometimes, so I guess a child's overall appeal (smile, hairstyle, size etc) could too? Or is it just one of those silly gymnastics myths?

 

[Mrs. Puma]

God I hope so....lol

 

[profmom]

Nope. Though if they are long and lanky, the knee bends and slightly less than straight arms may be more noticeable.

 

[cadybearsmommy]

Nope. Though if they are long and lanky, the knee bends and slightly less than straight arms may be more noticeable.

That makes a lot of sense! Never thought about it that way!

 

[gymdog]

No. Usually the youngest kids at a given level are likely to be the most talented and have the most physical advantages.

 

[duyetanh]

Not in our piece of the planet they arent!

 

[Taurus]

Just to toss a wrench into the washing machine here... our coach did have our girls practically race over to the judging table for introductions to get in some extra "smile" time / whatever works!

 

[duyetanh]

Just to toss a wrench into the washing machine here... our coach did have our girls practically race over to the judging table for introductions to get in some extra "smile" time / whatever works!

Hah! That's too funny...and adorable.

 

[Azgymmiemom]

In compulsories... Yes. They do. Been at many a judge table and heard them talk. You better be able to sell that routine!

 

[ZJsMom]

My dd's first level 4 meet, she went all deer in the headlights and blanked on the floor routine. She left out chunks of the routine and did the rest in the wrong order. She got something like a 5.5. I was afraid she'd be devastated. After the meet she said to me "They must have given me cuteness points because I don't think I even earned that much on floor."

 

[duyetanh]

In compulsories... Yes. They do. Been at many a judge table and heard them talk. You better be able to sell that routine!

Wow. Can you send those judges our way? My dd has been denied forever!

 

[profmom]

Ah, different animal. I don't believe in cute points based on the size and hairstyle of the gymnast. But a little benefit of the doubt based on how the gymnast presents her/himself? Absolutely. It's funny -- DS has that intangible factor on some events but not others. I've known a few who just had it. They salute and the minute they touch the equipment it seems to thrum and come alive for them, serving its natural purpose to provide a showcase for awesomeness.

 

[cadybearsmommy]

Just to toss a wrench into the washing machine here... our coach did have our girls practically race over to the judging table for introductions to get in some extra "smile" time / whatever works!

Haha, I love that! Great idea!

 

[cadybearsmommy]

I love the idea of really "selling" a routine. My dd has a more upbeat floor routine this year that she gets really into, tons of spunk and personality and it's very entertaining, but it doesn't seem to help her score at all. (although we've only done an in house meet so far this season.) Even though the audience loved it and she really brought down the house her score was about half a point lower than her more classical floor routine scored all season long last year. Now this could obviously be due to competing different/harder skills as well, and could be a coincidence. But I don't always get the feeling that gymnastics judges care for personality in routines. I'm sure this changes in the optional levels as I've seen some very entertaining routines that score really well. (we are Xcel so that's why she gets to have different routines every year.)

 

[Deleted member 18037]

You can have great presentation and do harder skills but if you don't do those skills well it will cost points and someone with less "selling" ability and lesser but more solid skills will score higher. Unless you are at a level where credit is given for
difficulty. I remember wanting the coach to add more artistic stuff to her Xcel routine and they coach was no she is fine, her skills are solid. Coach said if we add fluff and it isn't done well it will cost her points. They were absolutely correct.

As humans we all have bias, that might be different for individual judges but of course it exists. Maybe a judge can't stand pigtails. Another might prefer a more elegant look, another more athletic. Another not a fan of cutesy, or they hear piece of music that they love or hate. Another has higher expectations if you are older, another if you are younger. I also think some judges like being "played" to and some don't. I think they do their best to keep it in check but I think it bias credit can come into play. But as they are all diiferent I don't think there is a formula for what will work regarding bias credit.

I would say the one thing they probably don't like consistently is if they feel your phoning it in or going through the motions, in other words appear bored.

 

[raenndrops]

We tell the little ones that there is a "cute FACTOR" ... but that cute POINTS won't result in a bump of more than 0.05 - 0.10 in a routine.
When the judges are into a routine, they may not notice ALL of the minor text errors in the compulsory routines. In Optional routines, they may be SLIGHTLY more likely to believe something is part of the choreography if the gymnast is selling the routine.

I have seen that an optional gymnast (think Xcel Gold/ Platinum or L6/7) that does a "wrong" turn... even if it works and is allowable, will score higher if the judge can't "tell" by her change of expression. The "Oh, I just messed up" look will get the judge looking harder at the rest of the routine - even though it shouldn't.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I have seen that an optional gymnast (think Xcel Gold/ Platinum or L6/7) that does a "wrong" turn... even if it works and is allowable, will score higher if the judge can't "tell" by her change of expression. The "Oh, I just messed up" look will get the judge looking harder at the rest of the routine - even though it shouldn't.

Yep, and our girls gave back up/add ins if they forget something and wind up with extra time at the end. So it doesn't look like they messed up. Be it a leap or some extra arm swings or a couple of skips. As the coach says never just wait for the music to end, DO SOMETHING

 

[raenndrops]

Yep, and our girls gave back up/add ins if they forget something and wind up with extra time at the end. So it doesn't look like they messed up. Be it a leap or some extra arm swings or a couple of skips. As the coach says never just wait for the music to end, DO SOMETHING

That's what our coach says! ... but if they are consistently early ending in practice, I try to rework the music to shorten it. Last season, YG's music got cut from 1:00 to 0:39 ... and I would have cut it more, but I couldn't find a good stopping point at around 0:35, lol.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

That's what our coach says! ... but if they are consistently early ending in practice, I try to rework the music to shorten it. Last season, YG's music got cut from 1:00 to 0:39 ... and I would have cut it more, but I couldn't find a good stopping point at around 0:35, lol.

Our coach would adjust the routine not the music.

This is why our coach also likes to do JO and IGC. The girls get fun custom routines and they are comfortable with dealing with their own music and how to adjust when needed before they get to optionals.

 

[raenndrops]

Our coach would adjust the routine not the music.

This is why our coach also likes to do JO and IGC. The girls get fun custom routines and they are comfortable with dealing with their own music and how to adjust when needed before they get to optionals.

With YG, the problem is that her form wasn't the greatest on what she was adding in (she had at least 4 seconds, sometimes more... and was doing whatever came to mind). In that extra time, all she was doing was lowering her score. The one that I have recorded that I can readily find, she lost at least 0.5 in the time after she had all of her requirements finished.