Coaches Strenght level needed to get the kip

[gymisforeveryone]

I was once told by one coach at a camp that there is certain numbers of different strength exercises she's looking at before letting a gymnasts to start intensively work on kips. And if the kid can easily do all the strength stuff she/he can usually easily be taught the kip in a short time.

I don't remember the exact numbers anymore but she was looking at L-hold and pike hold on bars and leg lifts. And maybe pull ups? So my question is how much strength do you think is needed to get the (low bar) kip? How long L- and pike holds, how many leg lifts on stall bars and how many pull ups approximately?

I just ask this for fun and I know every child is different etc

 

[Iwannabemargo]

from my with Pink and Fluffy its more timing than strength - she has been able to out chin / OL hang all her gym buddies but still took a while to get the kip.

 

[BlairBob]

Timing will alleviate the necessary strength and generally older kids or adults can figure this out better (though not in my case). Some kids, the weaker ones get the timing before the kids who are actually stronger. I've seen this more with the older girls but we have these itty bitty or smaller girls who can rope climb, press HS and leg lift all day long but some of the older girls figure it out despite the fact that their physical strength is poor to meager.

That being said, I was told over 10 years ago 10 Hanging Leg Lifts by my boss which puzzled me since I could do that easily ( the most I have ever done is 43 way back then on a single rail [not stall bar] ). I think we both got this from bar clinicians at Congress because I know a few different coaches who have said this.

What I prefer these days is L and V hold. 20 second L-hang, 10 second V-hang. That's probably more than necessary but if a kid can do that, they are strong enough in their core to get it done and not have it being a limiting factor.

Ideally 10 quick HLL would be nice because they need to be able to glide and snap back their toes to the bar quickly to generate swing besides hold that sort of V to create a big swing before they push the bar down to support. I call this a "butt swing" but it's more similar to a basket swing.

I haven't really figured out a necessary number of pullups and dips. To be honest, I've seen some of the girls who could barely do more than a couple of each be able to make the kip and sometimes this is with straight arms (generally older girls who have had their kips a long time). Sometimes those girls who could barely pull or dip who also don't have very good core strength, well they just never get it fast as the kids who are physically strong with strong positions.

When I really focused on snapping my toes back to the bar and holding that V is what got me my kip. Same for some kids, so I cue it a lot.

 

[mimi]

That kinda sounds like my dd. Freakishly strong but one of the last to get her kip. It seemed like she couldn't grasp the timing. Now she is having the same problems with the clear hip to handstand. I was once told that some of the ultra strong kids can run into trouble with timing skills because they try to muscle through skills that shouldn't be muscled. Not sure if that is usually the case, but it certainly was/is in my dd's case. In end it took time and patience and once she got it, she never lost it. Fingers crossed on that clear hip!

 

[BlairBob]

Yes, weak kids have to rely on their technique because well, they are weak.

In the long run though, they don't have as much potential in Artistic Gymnastics towards the higher levels. Sometimes Acro, Trampoline, Rhythmic, other sports besides Gymnastics.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Weak kids also have a much higher injury rate in artistic.