WAG Scoring?

[htimcj]

DD10 first meet is in a week. To help prepare for it our gym held an exhibition to show off the routines in front of people. They weren't scored this year and I was just curious as to what everyone's thoughts of scoring these routines would be. I realize that it is hard from a video and I have no plans on sharing the info with DD, I am just curious as to where the deductions might be since at real meets all we see is the end score. I haven't been to a level 6 meet yet to really know what to expect either.

The little video shows L6 floor, vault and beam. I wasn't ready to record when bars started!
Thanks for any insight!
You can see the video here IEG exhibition - YouTube I hope !

 

[Quadqueen]

I will not attempt to score them...very clean routines!! The things that stood out to me were just those steps out of the front tuck on floor, and on beam, split jump needs to be bigger and her dismount needs to be held longer. Vault is really at a tough angle to see well. She looks great! And I love your leos...DD's team has them, but with red/maroon where your pink is

 

[htimcj]

Thanks for your insights! She got too close to the end of the beam at the beginning! Thanks about the leos. New for this year. We love them. Ours were a darker cherry color last year.

 

[SignHere]

Very pretty routines! I did notice some steps on floor, and her arm movements could be sharper. Also she wobbled a little on the full turn on floor. But her BWO was nice, as was the last tumbling pass (can't remember, was there a little step?). The beam routine was clean, just a few wobbles, and i don't know if she held the scale and handstand dismount long enough.

I tend to count deductions that I see in my head and can usually get pretty close to a "guesstimate" at Level 4 and 5 (I haven't watched too many Level 6s yet). I'd be surprised if she got lower than a low 9 or a high 8 with those 2 routines.

Vault wasn't at a good angle to see pre-flight or post- flight. All you could really see was that she had good form in the air and stuck the landing. At Level 6 , the judges are looking for a post flight that is suitable to the girls body type, and your DD looks longer and leaner, so they are probably going to look for her to be really getting some height and distance off the table (at least that is my understanding) . Dunno may post on here and tell me I am full of sh!t. You should listen to him!

Good luck to your DD as the meet season starts up! From what I hear Level 6 is a tough year, so try to have fun!
We are just starting our meet season (second meet next weekend) - younger DD as a Level 5 and older DD as a 5/6 ( will compete some meets as a second year 5, train 6, then move up to 6 when ready, she's had some fear issues).

 

[AmandaLynn]

I'm not a judge, nor am I currently coaching L6s, so I'm not going to venture to score those routines. However, is there a reason tht they are still using a "hurdle mat" on vault?

 

[profmom]

AmandaLynn, this may be a regional thing. Our girls used a hurdle mat for L6 and don't at L7. (We had a bit of drama and trauma around that issue for about a week in this house when DD realized that she wouldn't have it this year.)

I don't know what L6 judging is like elsewhere, but in this region, it's pretty tough. L6 girls get nickled and dimed for all of those little things like bent legs, not landing jumps with feet together, bobbles and wobbles, extra steps, etc. Your DD is doing a terrific job this early in the season, but don't go into the first meet expecting 9s. Around here, the floor score probably would have been a mid 8 and the beam a mid to high 8, keeping in mind that I am not a judge, but rather a mom who just finished watching a year of L6 meets. (Couldn't see vault well enough to guess, and I'm lousy at playing the guessing game with vault anyway!) But your girl is doing many, many things very well and should have a good year!

 

[AmandaLynn]

AmandaLynn, this may be a regional thing. Our girls used a hurdle mat for L6 and don't at L7. (We had a bit of drama and trauma around that issue for about a week in this house when DD realized that she wouldn't have it this year.)

The rule was changed this year.

http://usagym.org/PDFs/Women/Rules/Rules and Policies/2012_2013_w_rulespolicies.pdf

Pg 67. Chapter 5. II(Vault)-B(Runway)-3.

Jr. Olympic: A hand placement mat may be placed on therunway (but not on the board) ONLY for vaults that require placing the hands onthe runway in front of the board (Round-off or Front handspring entry.) Thehand placement mat must be manufactured by a gymnastics equipment company andcannot exceed 2 inches in height. No other type matting is allowed.

 

[gym law mom]

I'm not a judge, but have seen lots of L6 meets/routines. She is doing a good job with all the new skills, but as someone else said the judging at L6 is much tougher.
This is what I see: almost overdoing the arm postions on floor, steps after each tumbling pass, low landing on front tuck/looked a little low on back tuck, but couldn't tell. Beam--some balance checks, split leap could be bigger/try to make the leg split close to 180, hold on the scale/dismount were not long enough. She has nice form and I think she can push that scale up a little. The bwo was nice. Vault was too hard for me to see, but it looked like she wasn't getting much distance from the table on the post flight. I would have them all scoring in the low 8s right now. Really she's got everything down, its just cleaning it all up and being aggressive.
I love the leos too!!!!

 

[htimcj]

Thanks for looking. The vault is her toughest event. She is a lightweight and struggles to get much power of the springboard and the block is definitely hit and miss!

 

[Quadqueen]

I don't know how the judging/scoring is there...but my DD is L6 and everyone warned us that L6 judging is really tough. She's had two meets so far, and I haven't seen it (although a bunch of little things on bars sure does add up!). Good luck to her!

 

[Deleted member D3987]

The rule was changed this year.

http://usagym.org/PDFs/Women/Rules/Rules%20and%20Policies/2012_2013_w_rulespolicies.pdf

Pg 67. Chapter 5. II(Vault)-B(Runway)-3.

this is 100% accurate. no mats on the runway unless the vault is a yurchenko/front handspring entry. period.

 

[profmom]

Huh, didn't know about the rule change. All I knew was "OMG, Moooooom! We aren't allowed to use hurdle mats for L7 this year and I am NEVER gonna get the timing right!" I'm not sure she even remembers that particular freakout now. Thank goodness they are still allowing them for Yurchenkos. Anyway, if it helps anyone else out there talk a kid down off a cliff, it only took my DD about a week to adjust to vaulting without one.

 

[LiveLoveTumble]

At our gym we sometimes use a tape line on the floor to show us where to hurdle... I don't know if that's allowed for competition or not.

 

[wandrewsjr]

Yes, you can use a tape, chalk or velcro line for competition.

 

[htimcj]

I just told DD that they won't be able to use the mat at competitions and she wasn't too fazed by it. They only use it during practice I guess.

 

[iwannacoach]

I won't get specific, but if she's heard her hurdle is too high from her coaches, they're right....and she'll improve quickly on vault, light weight or not, as soon as she fixes it. She'll also do better with a low hurdle going into her punch front on floor, as the higher the hurdle....the more energy needed to reverse into an upward direction during the punch, and that extra energy is all she needs for really good punch front....really.

 

[htimcj]

Thanks Iwannacoach. I am always interested in the physics involved in these moves even though I couldn't do it to save my life! I asked DD if her coach as said anything about her hurdle being too high but she doesn't recall. She has an excellent tumbling coach, she is literally a world class tumbler, 2nd in the world in 2010 or 11. They have been focusing more on the back tuck lately. So I would imagine that it is on her mind. Of course something might have been said and DD10 just doesn't remember the exact words.

So for my understanding, a lower hurdle will give her more forward momentum/power in order to flip forward on the vault and or front tuck? Inquiring minds want to know

 

[sleeplessinnewyork]

Hi! I'm not 100% sure ,but to me, her routines her routines are very clean.
corrections- Floor was really nice-bigger straddle jump, 0.5 jump a little higher, land front tuck, a little wobbly on full turn, higher hitchkick, lever in bwo, and set a little higher in back tuck. I am being REALLY picky though as a warning. Overall, could be just a little "sharper" and more precise, straighter legs, ect.
Beam: Don't "double kick in back walkover, and hold the dismount a little longer.
Final thoughts, Judging in level 6 is brutal. In my region, there are only 1 or 2 9's per meet session!! I want to say that these routines would be mid 9's, 9.3-9.5/6 ish, but in level 6 judging, that number might fall a lot. Good Luck during the season!!

 

[iwannacoach]

So for my understanding, a lower hurdle will give her more forward momentum/power in order to flip forward on the vault and or front tuck? Inquiring minds want to know

An object in motion has energy, and will have it until it slows down or stops. I've found that changing directions requires energy, and if you consider a ball rolling across a room, you pretty much know that allowed to roll straight over a smooth surface it may have some left over energy when it gets to the other side. If you roll that same ball at the same speed across the same room, but put some miniature "speed bumps" where it's to roll, it will have to change directions in an up and down direction, and will lose energy with every up and down motion, so much so, that it may not even make it across the room. The same thing happens if the direction changes are side to side, just like at the bowling alley when beginners use bumpers to keep the ball in the lane......

So the idea is to keep direction change as slight and infrequent as possible. Looking at a high hurdle for a punch front, you see the kid running at a fairly consistent height above the floor. When they hurdle they usually lose some of their motion forward by using some of it to go up into the hurdle, and the higher the hurdle....the more energy is lost.

But wait, there's more! Just pay separate processi.....oops, wrong words, right idea, as in with one direction change to go up, the kid has a new direction of energy to deal with because what goes up...must come down. When it comes down there's going to be another "charge" against the original energy that was available just before the hurdle started, because the kid has to stop going down (a direction change) in order to rebound up into the front tuck....so you get a "two for the price of one" loss of energy with a high hurdle.

A low hurdle can be done with very sight to zero direction change, so it makes more of the kid's (the object's) energy available to rebound....and to create to salto's rotation........Basically it's a two-fer you want, because you can go higher and rotate the salto with more ease.

I mentioned frequency and magnitude, right? Figure this out. A vaulter takes around 12 steps from the start of their run to their hurdle....then they hurdle....contact the board....contact the vault table. So that makes it....like, 12 opportunities to lose energy, once on every step that sways slightly to the side....even if it's so small you can't see it, that sway is taking away energy....and then another three chances to lose energy when they hurdle to high +2, add 1 more if the hurdle goes slightly to one side of the board, when they come onto the table cooked and have to correct their direction....plus if they come on too high.......

The funny thing about gymnastics is that the skills aren't the hardest part about of the sport......it's the little things like forcing youself to run balanced, with a tight core that will eliminate as many "wobbles" as possible.

So if you ever wondered how our olympic team members make it look so Maroney....well, spend a little time thinking about it, and let me know if you need me to take it the rest of the way.

 

[gymmomtoo]

Agree with what others have said were deductions--here those routines would score in low to mid 8s (speaking of a parent who's watched many routines over the years, not as a coach or judge). Excellent start to the year!