Tsuk Tuck Full

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gymnastralo

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Hey! Im a level 9 gymnast and working on a Tsuk Tuck Full. I nedd help any drills or advice please.
 
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Geoffrey Taucer

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First, do you do a Kazamatsu-style twist or a Tsuk-style twist?

If you're not sure, which way do you twist, and which hand goes on the vault first on your entry?
 

Geoffrey Taucer

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Dag namit GT you took my question!

At least it makes me feel like a good coach and that I know what I'm talking about. :p
I'm... very flattered that you find us thinking alike a sign of you being a good coach.

gymstralo: there are two types of "tsuk full:" kazamatsu and tsuk.

A kazamatsu is when the direction of your twist is the direction of the hand you lead in with, and a tsuk is when they are opposite (ie if you lead with your left hand on the entry and twist left, it's a kaz; if you lead with your left hand and twist right, it's a tsuk full). Somewhat paradoxically (and I can explain this in more detail if you like), this means that a kazamatsu changes direction, whereas a tsuk full continues in the same direction. In a kaz, you basically do a 1/4 on, 3/4 off. In a tsuk 1/1, you do 1/4 on, 1 1/4 off. The kazamatsu is the easier of the two in my opinion, though by the time you are working this skill your twisting direction is probably already set and it's not worth the trouble of changing it.

If you're doing a kaz, it's actually a shockingly easy vault once you figure it out; in fact, I find a kaz to be significantly easier and more comfortable than a plain tsuk. It's essentially a tsuk arabian 1/2 out; done properly, you can see the landing for almost the entire skill. It feels more like a front 1/2 than a back 1/1. The key is making sure you spot the landing before that 1/2; if you do the final 1/2 too early, you're flying blind and it's almost impossible to land (not to mention extremely scary to do), but if you're patient and spot the ground (and this is assuming you have the necessary height and are comfortable with double front 1/2 out on a trampoline/into a pit/wherever), it's a very easy, natural-feeling vault. If you're having trouble getting the necessary height/rotation, focus on pushing back behind the head with the second hand (ie your right hand if you lead with the left) when you block. This will give you the first 1/4 twist, as well as the height and rotation you want.

If you're doing a tsuk full, I can't really give you any advice that's quite that specific, as I always did kazamatsus. I will, however, say that it will likely be helpful to have a very strong open-tucked tsuk, and to be comfortable with a front 1/2 in 1/1 out on trampoline (into a pit is fine, as long as you can spot the landing, and separate the 1/2 and the 1/1). There are probably other coaches who can help you more with this method than I can.

I've noticed -- and I'm not really sure why -- that guys coaches seem to tend more towards kazamatsus, and girls coaches seem to tend more towards tsuk fulls. In my opinion, a kazamatsu is much easier, simply because a front 1/2 out is easier to me than a back 1/1 out, though in all honesty there is likely not a gymnast on earth who can give a fair assesment of which is easier, as which one you will be able to do is generally set in stone long before you actually get to this level, as it has to do with your roundoff hand and your twisting direction.

If I haven't explained this well or it doesn't make sense, let me know and I'll see if I can break it down further. As I said, it will be very helpful to us to know which technique you will be using, as the methods for training the two techniques are very different.
 

Geoffrey Taucer

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Im a righty and my entry is like a right round off but then I twist left.
You're describing a tsuk 1/1...

It looks like this vault:
YouTube - Tsuk tuck full
... but this is a kazamatsu...

Ps. its not me. and I turn onto the table right.

Heres another example:
YouTube - mike tyler full twisting tuck tsuk
... and so is this.

DO you have any videos of you doing the vault? If you do a right roundoff and you twist to the left, you are doing a tsuk 1/1, but I want to make sure we're giving you the right advice here.
 
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gymnastralo

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I do not have any videos of me doing the skill but I think i doing a tsuk full. Sorry about the confusion. I turn onto the table right then on the snap down i pull my arms in toward the left.

Is this a tsuk full
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0nx_nyiUmQ
 
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gymkat

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If you do a righty roundoff, then you turn onto the table left.
 

Geoffrey Taucer

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I do not have any videos of me doing the skill but I think i doing a tsuk full. Sorry about the confusion. I turn onto the table right then on the snap down i pull my arms in toward the left.

Is this a tsuk full
YouTube - Tsuk Full - Joanna Nappi
Yes, that is a tsuk full.

Assuming you are doing a tsuk full rather than a kaz, there are two things that you should work in order to get this skill.

First, you should be comfortable doing an easy open tuck or layout tsuk with your arms out to the side while flipping. It would be a good idea to either work this to a raised landing or overrotate it to your back; you'll need more flip for a tsuk 1/1 than you will for a plain tsuk. As far as saying what sepcifically you need to do in order to get this height and rotation, I'd need to see a video of your vault.

Second, you should be comfortable doing a 1/2 in 1/1 out somewhere -- it doesn't matter if it's on a trampoline, off a trampoline into a pit, or whatever, but you should be comfortable with the orientation of the skill. And it should be a clear 1/2 in 1/1 out -- that is, it's not simply a double front with a 3/2 somewhere in it, it has to be a front 1/2 followed by a back 1/1. You should be comfortable spotting the landing on the back 1/1.
 
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