WAG Exceeding requirements in compulsories

[twisting007bigflip]

Is there a deduction for this?? I can't imagine that there is, but maybe I'm wrong...

A coach from another gym who went to congress (I did not go) and learned the routines from Tom Koll himself keeps telling me that he said if the athlete exceeds the requirement in the text, they will revive a deduction - even if the form is perfect. Specifically, if the handstand on beam states "hold 2 seconds" and the gymnast holds it 3 seconds, that's a deduction. He also told me that if the athlete exceeds the split requirement in leaps and jumps, they will receive a deduction even if it's a perfectly executed 180 degree split.

 

[twisting007bigflip]

Wasn't done...accidentally hit send..

Another specific was that if the athlete has arms in side middle on sissone instead of opposition, then deduction.

What about height of lift in ronde de jamb?? Is it seriously true that if they lift above 45 below horizontal they lose points??

This all seems ridiculous to me...I always encourage my kids to execute skills to exceed requirements if they have good form.

 

[GymSurvivor]

Not sure about most of it but the arms must be in opposition for the sissone. On the split leap they can be to the side or in opposition.

 

[twisting007bigflip]

Not sure about most of it but the arms must be in opposition for the sissone. On the split leap they can be to the side or in opposition.

I know that the text says "opposition" but what is the deduction for that specific skill if the arms are in side middle instead? I have one kid who's head explodes when she tries to do opposition arms in the sissone.

 

[AmandaLynn]

The arms in side middle as opposed to opposition would be a "text error". Text errors are up to 0.4 throughout the entirety of the routine, depending on the number and severity of the errors.

The leaps, all say "a minimum" of x degrees, so I would assume that exceeding that minimum would not be a deduction. The handstand holds specify a specific amount of time, so I would guess that there could be a deduction for holding those for too long.... Though I am not sure most judges would take one, unless it disrupts the flow of the routine...

 

[gymdog]

Holding the handstand for 3 seconds probably wouldn't be that big a deal. Longer would probably be a rhythm deduction.

The leap and split jumps thing isn't really a deduction, assuming both legs are straight and even (not tilted).

The question of the arms might get a small deduction like .05 if that's the only text error. Hard to say, that does seem pretty noticeable since there is no option there, but text errors are capped and taken over the routine as a whole. When judges see a text error, they generally put down either a little "t" or a big T depending on great the error was, and then total from there. My feeling is the arms would be a little t, so it probably wouldn't get much.

Lifting too far above in the rond de jombe would probably tilt the pelvis which they don't want. I think it's advisable to go to a height where there's no chance of tilting forward.

 

[saddlupasb]

Tom Koll has never said that exceeding the minimum would get a deduction. I personally would not take anything on a handstand held too long. I cant tell you how many times I've judged girls holding very long dismounts. The only thing that I would consider in that is maybe going overtime.
As far as the arms in the sissone go, it would be a text error. If it was the only text error I wouldn't take anything.

 

[iwannacoach]

I can see deducting for the handstand exceeding a nominal 2 second hold.... like what kid counts off 2 seconds the same pace as a judge..... The thing is the kids need to show control of the skill, and if they can't leave the handstand "on time" it would appear they have over extended the handstand rather than being able to hold it longer than the next kid.

The scissone' should have the arms in opposition to help with alignment and that pesky action/reaction thing that makes birds bob their heads as they walk. It was written into the text because the author wants kids to learn the skill properly.

As for the split leap being left to a coaches discretion, I'm assuming most kids have a lot less snap in their split leaps so counterbalancing to compensate for the legs splitting is less of an issue.

I have one kid who's head explodes when she tries to do opposition arms in the sissone.

Get the kid there in small steps by correcting what she does without telling her what it will become over time. It seems like nothing that gets changed ever feels right to beginning and intermediate level kids..... I guess that's why the sport is so demanding..... It often has to feel wrong for it to be done correctly.