Parents New Gym--Very different atmosphere

[Mariainlv]

So we are settled in So Cal. Things are VERY different, gym wise. I had a discussion with one of Js coaches and it kinda put me off. Basically, if they don't think the child will score above a 9, they don't compete that level. Seems kinda harsh to me. It does fit with the overall gym persona though I guess. I understand the need to have the skills to compete, but this seems alot more subjective. The coach basically told me if I want her to be mediocre, take her to a Y gym. They have standards here and thats why their gymnasts always win. I thought that was a harsh thing to say. I will say I am amazed that in J's training group, they are all 2-3 years older than her (kids hoping to compete L5 in the fall) There are 6 girls Js age in a "fast track group" and thats it. All the rest are L4 and below. This is a large gym with many kids but I guess the high(er) standards would keep many kids from being able to advance.

I'm wondering how common this is?

 

[kimmy4]

Hi. My first thought was maybe the coach means that they don't permit gymnasts to attend meets until they are "competition ready"? (giving him the benefit of the doubt). That is actually a good thing, as this sport is difficult enough, w/out having to be out there and not being ready. However, the part about scoring above a 9. only? Hmmm....intense for L4 and L5! And that does not seem right. I have no idea how common that practice is (sorry!). I guess it just depends on where your athlete fits, in relation to the new gyms philosophy, if this is going to work for you or not? I'm assuming she went for an evaluation prior and they have accepted her onto a team, correct? You'll need to decide if this is the right place for your gymnast. Personally, I don't agree with it....but, of course, everyone who has a competitor hopes for good scores...however, that does not mean a gymnast who would score in the 8's (for example) should not be permitted to compete. Good Luck with this and I wish you all the best. (I also think for some kids, this philosophy would work; for others, not so much! And would lead me to expect that only cetain kids would even be developed for potential longevity in the sport / the others would be a revenue source for the gym....just my opinion on that part...)....

 

[mariposa]

Hi MariainLV (or should I say, MariainSC )! Glad that you guys are getting settled in there. Hope that J is making good friends at school and enjoying her new gym.

As for the gym, yes it is pretty common from what I have heard, especially for gyms that score well all the time and take home those team trophies and top podium spots at every meet. They have to have some way of doing that, and obviously they just set their standards for competing very high. DDs gym, they aren't put out there unless they can score 8s on all events (not meaning they WILL score an 8 for sure, but that if they do their best, no falls, etc, they will get an 8). I think that is much more realistic. Sounds like the gym she is at probably doesn't push girls through the levels quickly (with the ages you mentioned) and that isn't a bad thing. Do they hold kids back even when they are ready to move up the next year to win? That would worry me a little more than having the high expectations. Do they have a lot of kids that don't compete because they aren't ready? Or do they have them repeat or what? Maybe having a chat with the parents would be in order, to see how they view the gym's philosophy.

My feeling on those types of gyms is that they aren't for everyone. And neither is a more relaxed gym. Some kids WANT to master each level and score 9s on all events. Some parents want that, too. It wouldn't work for my kid. Usually those gyms focus only on routines and level stuff during meet season and they work the little things over and over and over. That is how they score those 9s! My kid would rather uptrain all year and she would not like doing routines, routines, routines. LOL. Sure, there is a trade-off, but for her it is worth it. She holds her own and sometimes even places really well! In a really big meet against the "big dogs", she will be middle of the pack, but that is okay.

Sounds like you need to assess whether the gym's philosophy works for J. Is she happy? What led you to choose this gym when you were first looking?

 

[NGL780309]

I don't think the gym wanting the girls to have the potential to score at least a 9.0 on every event is that uncommon. I live in a highly competitive area and I think most gyms feel that way around here. I know at DD's gym they don't prevent girls from competing that aren't at that standard, they just don't let them compete placement. They have to compete achievement until they score a 35AA. I've never heard it said specifically that you must be able to score a 9.0 on every event, but I think they want the girls to have the potential to score that well. It doesn't mean they must get a 9.0 every single time, but they must be consistently doing their routines in practice without major mistakes and look polished.

 

[Mariainlv]

Hi. My first thought was maybe the coach means that they don't permit gymnasts to attend meets until they are "competition ready"? (giving him the benefit of the doubt). That is actually a good thing, as this sport is difficult enough, w/out having to be out there and not being ready. However, the part about scoring above a 9. only? Hmmm....intense for L4 and L5! And that does not seem right. I have no idea how common that practice is (sorry!). I guess it just depends on where your athlete fits, in relation to the new gyms philosophy, if this is going to work for you or not? I'm assuming she went for an evaluation prior and they have accepted her onto a team, correct? You'll need to decide if this is the right place for your gymnast. Personally, I don't agree with it....but, of course, everyone who has a competitor hopes for good scores...however, that does not mean a gymnast who would score in the 8's (for example) should not be permitted to compete. Good Luck with this and I wish you all the best. (I also think for some kids, this philosophy would work; for others, not so much! And would lead me to expect that only cetain kids would even be developed for potential longevity in the sport / the others would be a revenue source for the gym....just my opinion on that part...)....

Yes, they accepted her on their team. She has been attending for 4-5 weeks. Friday night after practice her coach pulled me aside to fill me in on where she stands/what the plan is. I asked about competition/level determination at the gym. I went and looked @ scores and most of the kids are scoring in the high 36/low 37 range..

 

[Mariainlv]

Hi MariainLV (or should I say, MariainSC )! Glad that you guys are getting settled in there. Hope that J is making good friends at school and enjoying her new gym.

As for the gym, yes it is pretty common from what I have heard, especially for gyms that score well all the time and take home those team trophies and top podium spots at every meet. They have to have some way of doing that, and obviously they just set their standards for competing very high. DDs gym, they aren't put out there unless they can score 8s on all events (not meaning they WILL score an 8 for sure, but that if they do their best, no falls, etc, they will get an 8). I think that is much more realistic. Sounds like the gym she is at probably doesn't push girls through the levels quickly (with the ages you mentioned) and that isn't a bad thing. Do they hold kids back even when they are ready to move up the next year to win? That would worry me a little more than having the high expectations. Do they have a lot of kids that don't compete because they aren't ready? Or do they have them repeat or what? Maybe having a chat with the parents would be in order, to see how they view the gym's philosophy.

My feeling on those types of gyms is that they aren't for everyone. And neither is a more relaxed gym. Some kids WANT to master each level and score 9s on all events. Some parents want that, too. It wouldn't work for my kid. Usually those gyms focus only on routines and level stuff during meet season and they work the little things over and over and over. That is how they score those 9s! My kid would rather uptrain all year and she would not like doing routines, routines, routines. LOL. Sure, there is a trade-off, but for her it is worth it. She holds her own and sometimes even places really well! In a really big meet against the "big dogs", she will be middle of the pack, but that is okay.

Sounds like you need to assess whether the gym's philosophy works for J. Is she happy? What led you to choose this gym when you were first looking?

As far as what led us there, its the closest appropriate gym. There are 2 gyms closer but one has all but shut its doors and the other has more of a rythmic focus. Since J has never been in a gym like this, I have no idea whether this will work. I guess I will follow her lead. If she is happy, I am happy. I would like to talk to other parents but that just doesnt seem like the culture at the gym. Not very friendly. She has been there 5 weeks and we haven't been formally accepted into the inner circle I guess (I joke, mostly..)

 

[mariposa]

Sounds like she is probably at the best gym then right now. Bummer on the parent situation. If it is a big gym, hopefully you will find someone to make friends with soon. When meet season starts, I think it is easier to make friends. Though it is always nice when parents go out of their way to make new parents feel welcome. I always try to do that, having been the new guy before.

I also think it will take a little while for J to get accustomed to new coaches, she will likely have to re-learn skills and routines because every gym does it a little different. That can be frustrating, so be prepared. My DD was very frustrated for awhile when she moved gyms and had to re-learn the L4 routines because she felt like she already knew them. It takes awhile for them to adjust to everything.

For now I wouldn't worry. Seems like she is in a gym with high standards and you will just have to wait and see how J likes it and if she fits into that mold. I have no doubt that she can be scoring 9s by fall if she is given the right tools. There is plenty of time until meet season!!

 

[3rd_time_around]

As far as what led us there, its the closest appropriate gym. There are 2 gyms closer but one has all but shut its doors and the other has more of a rythmic focus. Since J has never been in a gym like this, I have no idea whether this will work. I guess I will follow her lead. If she is happy, I am happy. I would like to talk to other parents but that just doesnt seem like the culture at the gym. Not very friendly. She has been there 5 weeks and we haven't been formally accepted into the inner circle I guess (I joke, mostly..)

This makes me sad!!!

 

[UnoMas]

Wow that must really be something to have to deal with that news about the 9's thing. We have something kind of similar for the first part of our season. Our gym only lets girls that have a certain "in-gym" score (which I think is pretty much the potential to get 9.0 plus and 36AA) compete in the early season FALL meets. But then everyone is generally allowed to compete in the spring meets. I think it is done as a motivational thing to keep the girls pushing themselves hard throught the summer (we are not a gym that uptrains a lot) and it gives them something to shoot for since fees are usually due for those early meets on September 1. The routines have to be pretty close to perfect, not just being able to do the skills but do them, well, pretty close to perfectly. It is always a stressful time and can make for some bad feelings. I guess my feeling is, that if a child can do the skills or even MOST of the skills in a level and be safe doing them, AND they are working hard and attending practice, they should compete. But hey that is just my mom opinion. I'm sorry you are having to deal with this new set of rules. I hope it goes ok for J and for your family!

 

[cadybearsmommy]

I can definitely understand your concern and I would definitely watch your dd closely and make sure she isn't feeling too pressured or overwhelmed. But as long as she is happy, it seems like you will be ok where you are at! There can be some good things about a "perfectionist" gym like this, I bet your dd will end up having beautiful form!

I hope the parent situation improves soon! Maybe they feel threatened by your dd coming in since it is such a highly competitive atmosphere? I hope they warm up to you soon. Are the other girls being nice to your dd or are they icing her out too?

 

[AlexsGymmyMom]

At that gym my DD would never compete!! LOL !!! What alot of pressure for those girls!!! I hope it works out well for you and your DD. She will have plenty of time to fine tune everything before next fall! Sounds like the atmosphere in the viewing area may be a little bit awkward for awhile. Hang in there and soon they will warm up to you!!

 

[cher062]

Ok my question is if they don't go to a meet to compete how do they know if they scored above a 9.0?
For me I would pull my kid out of there. It goes against everything I believe. I think kids should have FUN before they consintrate on just winning. There is more to gymnastics than winning and it doesn't mean you don't have the skills or are mediocre if you don't score a 9.0 Heck there are judges out there that are very tough in their scoring. Also at L4 - L5 that is for me at least the time to do the best you can and get use to the process of the Meet so when you finally get to Optionals you aren't so afraid at a meet. Yup I definitly wouldn't want that pressure that gym is putting on the gymnasts for my daughter.

 

[Panda-girl's Mom]

I do not know if I care for the focus on getting high scores but at least they were up front about it and they have a set criteria. My daughters gym has girls scratching events if they feel they are not good enough to do it in a competition but they never tell the parents ahead of time. It is kind of up to the coaches and it is often very subjective and it can be very unconsistent, but I am not a gymnastics coach but what do I know. I would see how your daughter likes the gym and give it sometime. It could turn out to be a good gym. As far as the other parents being unfriendly I do not care for that but maybe give them sometime to warm up to.

 

[gympunkin]

Welcome to Southern California! I am fairly new to gymnastics (my daughter had been doing gymnastics for about a year and a half and is currently training to compete level 4 next fall) so bear that in mind in reading this post.

From what I have seen so far, this is a very competitive area. Everyone here wants their gymnast to score high. If you go to the Southern California USAG website ( Southern California Women's Gymnastics: Meet Director's ), you will see that there are actually complaints about girls with high scores. Some gyms have girls repeat levels (usually 4 and 5) to get high scores for the team (and to win individual awards). The organization has tried several fixes for this over the years (mentioned on the website). The current fix is a rule that girls who score 37AA or higher at states and who then repeat the level cannot have their scores included in any team score the year they repeat. Isn't it crazy that such a rule even needs to exist?! I think that holding girls back from competing a level until they seem capable of a high score (as you are seeing at your gym) is part of the same mindset that makes girls with 37's repeat a level.

I don't know how widespread this is. We live near 3 well-established gyms, and here is what they are like. The first gym is probably one of the gyms that the 37AA rule was designed for. They require a very high level of skill before a girl can compete. It is very common for girls at that gym to repeat level 4 and level 5. A schoolmate of my daughter's attends this gym. She scored over 36AA at states her first year as a level 5, but still repeated level 5. This gym has had its compulsory teams win state championships numerous times. My daughter was in a pre-team group at that gym for a couple of months and hated it. I do not think that I can convey the tedious, repetitive nature of that training. She really wanted to quit gymnastics completely. We ended up switching gyms.

The second gym in the area has had girls on the national team. My daughter tried out there. She liked everything she did in the two-hour pre-team class, but it was so fast-paced that she was exhausted at the end. In that gym's view, the first gym held girls, including my daughter, back, to the girl's detriment. The second gym was not as focused on winning compulsory competitions, but the training hours were ridiculously high. For the compulsory level girls, the gym seemed very focused on TOPS - the only "winnning" banners I saw in the gym were related to TOPS.

We ended up at the third gym in the area, which is the most relaxed. However, there are girls in my daughter's level 4 training group who will have been in the group for two years by the time they end up competing next fall. They are still training because the gym did not feel that they were ready to compete and was worried that they would get scores below an 8 and "feel humiliated." It is expected that at a minimum every girl on the team will qualify for states (which is actually not that hard - last year required a 32AA.) It is very common for the level 5 girls to repeat that level. The pressure is not all from the gym. Level 4's train 9 hours a week, and level 5's train 12 hours a week. Many parents have tried to get the owner to increase the training hours so that their kids can score better in competitions. (Our gym competes against at least two gyms where the girls train 20 hours a week for level 4.) She will not. I think her position is correct, but it has resulted in a number of the well-off parents adding private lessons for their daughters.


I hope that your gym works out for your daughter, or failing that, that you find a more compatible gym that is not too far from your home. Good luck!

 

[Swiftli]

Oh my! My DD trains in one of those "mediocre Y" programs and I have to say when we complete against big USAG gyms we do have quite a few standouts in the 36AA-37AA range. So raspberries to that coach who put us down.

 

[littlegirlsdream]

New atmospheres take a while. We made a move with DD last year from a gym like you moved to, to a more relaxed gym. Believe it or not this was equally hard on her. As it turns out she does not like the less competitive strict environment. The key seems to be finding the right gym mentality that fits your kid. what sounded strict and like a bit much to us our daughter actually thrived on. There was a sense of pride in her and she felt her success, this year not so much. I hope you both adjust quickly being the new one isn't easy.

 

[Mariainlv]

Swiftli, I hope I was clear that I think that comment was not warrented. I agree, there is NOTHING wrong with the Y. If there was one close, my pocketbook would be happy as thats where we would be!

Thanks for all the comments! To clarify, I dont think the other parents have been mean. More like they all have known each other for a long time and are set in their groups. It doesnt help that J isnt with kids her age, so no real friendships. Most of the kids are nice to her but one in particular is downright mean. I told J to just ignore her comments and focus on the kind people. No need to add fuel to that girls fire.

I will watch and follow Js lead. I am quickly seeing that SoCal is uber competitive. Yeah, Vegas, not so much...

 

[Swiftli]

Swiftli, I hope I was clear that I think that comment was not warrented. I agree, there is NOTHING wrong with the Y. If there was one close, my pocketbook would be happy as thats where we would be!

I know it isn't your views

I think Y programs get a bad wrap sometimes. What some may not know that not all Y programs are low hours and low costs and low scoring. Which is why I love this forum so we can all share our experiences and try to understand this crazy sport. My DD lvl 7 trains 20hours a week and the monthly fee is comparable to the exclusive private gyms in our area. Trust me, I also would LOVE to give my pocketbook a break

 

[gymjourneymom]

I know it isn't your views

I think Y programs get a bad wrap sometimes. What some may not know that not all Y programs are low hours and low costs and low scoring. Which is why I love this forum so we can all share our experiences and try to understand this crazy sport. My DD lvl 7 trains 20hours a week and the monthly fee is comparable to the exclusive private gyms in our area. Trust me, I also would LOVE to give my pocketbook a break

Thanks Swiftli! That is what I love about CB too! We can all learn from each other! Sometimes I think many of us only see things from the perspective that our DD's gym experience has taught us. It's interesting to hear all of the different ways there are experience this sport! I find it interesting when I read people act like Prep Optional is low stress or low hours. Prep Op in our area is extremely competitive with L9/L10 girls competeing it! Yes, it's wise not to "classify" a gymnast just because she's from a "Y" gym or a Prep Op program. She may just be up on that podium ahead of a "big name JO gym" gymnast at your next meet! I have seen it for myself!

Good luck to your DD Mariainlv! I wish her much joy & success in her training no matter where she trains!