WAG Is this unsafe coaching?

[RileyG]

My dtr competed Xcel Gold level last year, this summer she is working on some higher skills. She has ROBHSBT in her routine and her coach wants her to work on back layout to replace the tuck.
so after practice last night she said the coach wanted her todo the layout but she wouldn't do it . I asked how the coach was spotting. My dd told me the coach was not spotting her, she told her to just " go for it" and do the layout.

Is this common? Is this how this skill should be taught? Seems dangerous to me.

 

[Brandon]

He should definitely be standing there in case he needs to catch her. If she doesn't have enough height or rotation she may 'space out' and land on her face. Or she might stay tight but just under rotate and also land on her face.

Of course there's the possibility that she'll be just fine, but he needs to be there just in case.

 

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Depends

In most cases, no, I would not consider that to be a safe or acceptable approach, but there are some details that could change my view on that; or more specifically, there are ways of learning a back layout that do not necessarily require a spotter. Was she doing it on the floor? A tumbletrak? A Trampoline? Into a pit? Did the coach spot her on several first, and then tell her to go for it without?

I would consider a layout to be technically easier than a tuck, because the body movements involved are much simpler (and in fact, I introduce layouts before tucks whenever possible). When (if ever) it's appropriate to tell a kid to "go for it" depends heavily on the progressions being used, the quality of the ROBHS, the gymnast's style and tendencies, and a host of other factors.

 

[Brandon]

^ agreed. I assumed she had never done one before. If she has, the coach is probably just pushing her because he doesn't want her to always think that she 'needs' him there. If she hasn't find them before then my other post still stands.

And of course if its into a put then its fine also.

 

[RileyG]

She has never done one at all. Not on tumble track,floor, trampoline. Nothing.
she has a lot of height on her set and when she tucks, but it just seemed odd to me to just have her go for one on the floor with no spot. And no progressions prior.

 

[Flipomaniak]

That is how I learned mine... It can work.

 

[Brandon]

That is how I learned mine... It can work.

It can. It can also get you injured.

 

[Flipomaniak]

I learned a lot of skills like this. Sometimes you just have to go for it...

 

[Brandon]

Sometimes you do, yeah. But there's no reason he should be forcing her to 'just go for it' when all it takes is him standing near her to make it 5 times safer.

For things that can't really be efficiently spotted you have to go for it. A layout is not one of those things.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

i learned a lot of skills like this. Sometimes you just have to go for it...

yikes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[gymmomof1]

At dds gym they have stations with the skill broken down (ie. One station round off punching up to stacked mats and landing on back). They do the skill onto the pit then onto a resin and final progression is on the floor. I don't remember if they are spotted for layout.

 

[profmom]

By the time DD put her first layout on the floor, she had done it on and off a tramp, off a tumbltrak, off an air floor and onto a mat, and a couple other things I can't now remember approximately five billion times. But perhaps your DD has done a whole bunch of preparatory drills? I don't remember her getting spotted to do them on the floor, but it's possible she was; I don't watch full practices very often.

Just a stab in the dark -- but is it possible she's been doing a bunch of preparatory drills that she didn't recognize as such? My beloved offspring don't always know why they're doing what they're doing in the gym, and I'm certainly not engaged or knowledgeable enough to understand everything that's going on and where it's leading.

 

[RileyG]

By the time DD put her first layout on the floor, she had done it on and off a tramp, off a tumbltrak, off an air floor and onto a mat, and a couple other things I can't now remember approximately five billion times. But perhaps your DD has done a whole bunch of preparatory drills? I don't remember her getting spotted to do them on the floor, but it's possible she was; I don't watch full practices very often.

Just a stab in the dark -- but is it possible she's been doing a bunch of preparatory drills that she didn't recognize as such? My beloved offspring don't always know why they're doing what they're doing in the gym, and I'm certainly not engaged or knowledgeable enough to understand everything that's going on and where it's leading.

your second paragraph could be entirely true. she said something about doing something into the pit one night awhile back. I didn't think much of it. she didnt say anything then about layouts. I will ask her again.
I am just glad to hear I wasnt being overly dramatic thinking it was potentially unsafe.
my dd tends to have mental blocks creep up a lot too, and this coach has had good success with her getting past them and sometimes it did involve a just go for it thing. but I thought since she had not done a ton of these with spotters near her, that to go for it is dangerous especially if there is a mental block about it going on.

 

[Hayleigh]

when I changed my tuck back for a straight back my coach told me to just "go for it" on the sprung floor. All she did was put a foam topper mat where I was going to land as her opinion was if I was able to do a double back into a pit I had enough height for a straight back. This worked for me and I've never hurt myself on this variety of skills.(touch wood)

 

[ivyagogo]

I tend to overspot at my gym but as for myself, I learned everything on my own in my yard. I had no coaching until I was in middle school. I could already do a roundoff - back handspring - back tuck, side aerial, walkovers, etc. Just my and my lawn. Of course, my form still leaves much to be desired.

 

[Gymnast9272]

If she's trying a new skill,she needs a spot. Especially on a back layout because she could land on her head, face, back, or bottom and get hurt. So no,it's not normal.

 

[RileyG]

So I asked her if there had been any drills or progressions for the layout. If they did them on the tumbletrack etc. and she said no. Nothing.
The other night on the floor she was told to just do it no spot.
should I say something to the head coach? She is normally there but happened to not be there on this particular night.

 

[Gymnast9272]

I think you should ask the head coach if she thinks she should do it with or without a spot. If she says no spot,then no spot. If you still think she should have a spot,then talk to the coach about it.

 

[htimcj]

I asked DD if she had a spot on her first back layout on the floor and she didn't. Coach said to just go for it. BUT she already had a very good round off back tuck and had done them on the tumble track, rod floor, from a springboard and into a pit so it wasn't as if she had never done it before. But there definitely wasn't a spot once they moved to the floor.

 

[gymmomof1]

So I asked her if there had been any drills or progressions for the layout. If they did them on the tumbletrack etc. and she said no. Nothing.
The other night on the floor she was told to just do it no spot.
should I say something to the head coach? She is normally there but happened to not be there on this particular night.

Yes say something like "oh dd is working on layout do the coaches spot them or have they been doing drills". From what I see at my dds gym they work up to skills and not chuck them. They could be doing drills for it and your dd may not even realize that's what its for lol.