level 8 bars ?

[sportyfam5]

I have a scoring question. My DD does a cast handstand on low bar and high bar. She does her clear hip on low bar. She doesn't always hit handstand on casts but comes really close. Her clear hips are not to handstand.
Her team mate does none on the low bar. Her cast on high bar is pretty bad, not even close to hand stand and arms bent, back arched. She does clearhip to almost handstand into giants.
My question is, can my DD be getting more deductions on form when she doesn't hit handstand on both. Whereas her team only attempts one? The team mate has been scoring higher at meets but I think my DD looks better. I will try to post a video. We are very good friends with team mate and family. I am just wondering how to help DD increase score.
Although they both hope to go 9 next year so it will all change anyway.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

gotta see them both.

 

[Pineapple_Lump]

Not sure because I judge under a different set of rules, but I would be hammering your DD's straddle back: not caught with support, brush/hit(fall) on mat, large knee bend (to avoid crashing into the mat), elbows bent. I don't really get why the coach has this element in the routine as the way it is being performed does not really develop to further skills. She is also bending her arms in casts, and I would also deduct for the straddle when she fails to get to handstand.

 

[sportyfam5]

Thanks. I realize she has a lot of form deduction but so does her team mate. I am trying to post video of both girls.

 

[sportyfam5]

[video=youtube;mFj6a0sZhZE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFj6a0sZhZE[/video]
Here are some clips of some of their recent meets.
I just find the scoring so interesting and always try to find out as much as I can. I don't even always share it with my DD.

 

[2gymmies]

It won't let me watch the video, says it is private, but I've watched your dd before. I'm not a judge, but I know around here there is alot of value on hitting those handstands, even more than hitting clear hip to handstand. Also, I know coaches also tend to say that less elements = less potential deductions so it definitely possible that your dd's extra kip cast handstand is making a small difference. Your dd is very close to hitting handstands, I'm sure they will get more consistent while training level 9!

By the way, I think its neat that your dd does something other than 1/2 pirouette for Level 8!

 

[sportyfam5]

It won't let me watch the video, says it is private, but I've watched your dd before. I'm not a judge, but I know around here there is alot of value on hitting those handstands, even more than hitting clear hip to handstand. Also, I know coaches also tend to say that less elements = less potential deductions so it definitely possible that your dd's extra kip cast handstand is making a small difference. Your dd is very close to hitting handstands, I'm sure they will get more consistent while training level 9!

By the way, I think its neat that your dd does something other than 1/2 pirouette for Level 8!

Thank you. I tried to change the video so it isn't private but not sure if it worked. I know where my DD is getting deductions on form and such. What I am confused on is why her team mate who has just as many if not more form issues and cast handstand that doesn't even go horizontal is often scoring higher.

 

[gymcoach34]

from a coaching/judging perspective-her teammates routine is slightly cleaner on the straddle back, giants and flyaway. She also only has 1 hs which helps her score wise for sure. It looks like your daughter is improving at every meet-thats all the matters.

 

[2gymmies]

I could see the video now. I'm not a judge but I definitely see why you are wondering between the two girls.

 

[bogwoppit]

For me I do not get why either girl competes the straddle back. The other skills are clearly improving each time, and their score are so close that it is insignificant. But those straddle backs are just a bucket load of deductions.

What would they lose on start value for not having them? Would it be less than the deductions.

I just think that training routines with a skill so badly done will hinder forward progress. Training routines without that skills would be so much more rewarding, meanwhile training the straddle back with good form for future routines.

Other than that each meet the routines get cleaner, which is what you would expect.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

they look the same to me deduction wise. and both of their counter swings need work. but what do i know...i DUNNO. lol.

 

[gymdog]

I took the deductions I saw on both routines. The second routines in the video, which were far better than the first. I think the second scores are about right on so there should have been more separation in the scores between the first and second routines.

Here's what I have for your DD:
Bent arms - .1
Bent arms - .2 Amp - .1
Bent legs - .2 Bent legs - .2 Brush/hit on mat - .3
Bent arms - .05
Bent legs - .1
Shape - .1
Bent legs - .05
Shape - .1
Bent legs .05
Total: 8.45

Teammate:

Bent legs - .2 Brush - .3
Cast amp - .3 Shape - .2
Shape - .2
Shape - .1
Shape - .1
Total: 8.6

Major difference to me is straight legs before release on SB - with mostly similar mistakes in other things. Bent arms is the other issue, at least in the second routines (first routines both had some bent arms going on).

 

[gym law mom]

I think it comes down to the more skills performed the bigger chance for deductions. I do agree with the others in that they are both getting nailed on the straddle back and other form problems--flexed feet, bent arms/legs and arching in the giants.

 

[sportyfam5]

For me I do not get why either girl competes the straddle back. The other skills are clearly improving each time, and their score are so close that it is insignificant. But those straddle backs are just a bucket load of deductions.

What would they lose on start value for not having them? Would it be less than the deductions.

I just think that training routines with a skill so badly done will hinder forward progress. Training routines without that skills would be so much more rewarding, meanwhile training the straddle back with good form for future routines.

Other than that each meet the routines get cleaner, which is what you would expect.

Our HC prefers straddle back. I believe because it prepares them for next level. We are not a hugely competitive team. My DD started L8 3 years ago when she was 10 and her straddle back did not drag on ground. As she has gotten taller and maybe lazier she drags her feet. She is working hard on fixing that too. The team mate can't do pirouette because she can't cast hand stand. I now there are other options. My DD had hoped to go L9 this year but over the summer had some issues with giants and back handspring series on beam so stuck out L8 another year.
We do see huge improvements at practice. I just can't wait until she puts it in a meet. She is probably capable of high 35's.

 

[sportyfam5]

I took the deductions I saw on both routines. The second routines in the video, which were far better than the first. I think the second scores are about right on so there should have been more separation in the scores between the first and second routines.

Here's what I have for your DD:
Bent arms - .1
Bent arms - .2 Amp - .1
Bent legs - .2 Bent legs - .2 Brush/hit on mat - .3
Bent arms - .05
Bent legs - .1
Shape - .1
Bent legs - .05
Shape - .1
Bent legs .05
Total: 8.45

Teammate:

Bent legs - .2 Brush - .3
Cast amp - .3 Shape - .2
Shape - .2
Shape - .1
Shape - .1
Total: 8.6

Major difference to me is straight legs before release on SB - with mostly similar mistakes in other things. Bent arms is the other issue, at least in the second routines (first routines both had some bent arms going on).

Thank you this is exactly what I was looking for! I may share that with her.

 

[sportyfam5]

from a coaching/judging perspective-her teammates routine is slightly cleaner on the straddle back, giants and flyaway. She also only has 1 hs which helps her score wise for sure. It looks like your daughter is improving at every meet-thats all the matters.

Actually the videos are posted in reverse order. So no progression, lol.