Is this how most advanced rec programs are? warning:Rant!

[My_2_Gym_Monsters]

DD 4 is on her third session of the advanced kinder gym class for 3-5 year olds. I was fine with it at first. Her class had about 6 girls, a head coach and an assistant. Sessions are 10 weeks (which adds to the inconsistency IMO). The next session we got a different coach. She was more focused on form and building strength, but not flexibility ( no stretching at all).

Now, in our third session on Tuesday's we have have the same coach as last time but on Thursdays we have two of the younger girls coaching (not yet driving age). They are not the best at keeping everyone on task and don't seem to take the job very seriously at all. There are now 8 girls in the class. I have no idea what the criteria is that they look for when selecting the girls. Now, we have some very young girls that are really struggling so the head coach works with them. There are also older 5's in the class that are more mature so they get attention too. I feel like DD 4 gets passed along and hardly noticed. She has natural form but really needs to build skill. They basically do obstacle courses the entire time. If they happen to actually watch her doing something they just point her on to the next thing.

We are most likely moving back to the states soon where dd will also do gymnastics. I'm wondering how this compares to the states. I picture being laughed out of the gym when I ask to have her evaluated. I feel like she should be much further along than she really is. I think I'm just frustrated with the program as a whole. I also know this is a complete rant. Thanks for reading anyway!

 

[bogwoppit]

As the Canadian system doessn't really have girls competing until they turn 9, or thereabouts, it means that real preteam may start later than in the USA.

As you are moving back to the USA soon I wouldn't bother trying to change much, unless your dd is very bored. Even in a US club your dd would be young in any pre team.

The idea of gym at this age is to have fun whilst learning some very basic skills. Not all clubs run big enough programmes to have year round and consistent preteam for girls of her age.

 

[My_2_Gym_Monsters]

I'm just complaining . I couldn't change gyms as the next closet one is an hour away. I didn't even think about her being bored. I can tell that she seems frustrated with the lack of attention. I can tell that quite often now she asks for help or to be "watched". I do want her to have fun. I guess I should just be thankful we have a gym for her to go to. Sometimes, it's just so frustrating to watch.

 

[sportyspice]

Sometimes when parents watch gymnastics it is frustrating because we focus on what is not happening rather than what is.

Your DD has learnt some valuable life skills in asking for help and coping with frustration in a positive way.

At 4 years old your DD does not require any "gymnastics skills" in order to progress. A little conditioning, flexibility and having fun is all that counts right now. If she really wants to learn more, it should come naturally in doing handstands or cartwheels around the house.

 

[My_2_Gym_Monsters]

Sometimes when parents watch gymnastics it is frustrating because we focus on what is not happening rather than what is.

Your DD has learnt some valuable life skills in asking for help and coping with frustration in a positive way.

At 4 years old your DD does not require any "gymnastics skills" in order to progress. A little conditioning, flexibility and having fun is all that counts right now. If she really wants to learn more, it should come naturally in doing handstands or cartwheels around the house.

Thank you for that perspective. It is very true.

 

[jcs]

The gym my DD goes to basically has obstacle courses for pre-school but once they turn 5 they move to a beginner class or are asked to be on pre-team. 3 and 5 year olds are very different in their ability (I have a 3 and a 5 yr old), so I can imagine it would be difficult to keep them all on task. I know the coaches at DD's gym are always on the lookout for kids who would be good for team so if your DD has that potential, they will identify her. I also think when you move let the new gym know how many sessions she has done and you aren't sure what level she should be. Our gym does a free trial class so for a 5 year old who did rec they would probably say come to a beginner class and then see how she does and recommend from there.

 

[juststartingout]

I'm new and don't know much but I would guess the lack of skill building is because of the age group. I also have a 3yo and a 5yo and just to put things into perspective my 3yo is working on cartwheels (and in the early learning stages of this) while my 5yo just did her back handspring by herself for the first time today on the floor. My 3yo does not have the strength or attention span to do the stuff my 5yo is doing. Maybe some 3yos do but most don't so it's got to be a hard group for the coaches to work with.

 

[mumoftwogymnasts]

She is 4 years old, at this age it is firstly about having fun, also learning some basic gymnastic skills and learning how to actually be in a structured environment. Things like waiting in line until its your turn, listening to the coach, asking for help and learning to stay focused are skills that will not only help with gymnastics, but also with school and life in general.

If your daughter chooses to stay with gymnastics she has many many years ahead of her... at 4 years old you want her to be falling in love with the sport, the rest will come later.

 

[Faith]

It sounds very much like the pre-school classes we have in the UK. It's called "fun-damentals" and it basically is as you describe, obstacle courses!

If you look into it though it is all designed to build skills. As well as the discipline, waiting turn, following instructions stuff, you'll see the obstacle courses do have a plan. They'll do balancing, throwing, jumping etc, all aimed at building motor skills for any sport they choose to continue with.

As long as she's having fun that's all that matters at 4 years old

 

[emorymom]

Well, IMO yes getting out of rec classes the sooner the better gives you some actual instruction for your money.

When you take her in to be evaluated for whatever your US gym offers -- perhaps a feeder class for the 5ish year olds for pre-team -- they are going to be looking at attitude/attention, strength, flexibility, and skills that require a combination of vestibular ability and some practice, like cartwheels. If you give them any 2, you're likely to do well in the evaluation. So, if you start spending a little time with her stretching, and have her practice chin-ups and leg lifts, you'll probably be able to get her into the developmental stream.

 

[kecks]

Why on earth would you try to do stretching and such things at home with a little kid (she's 4. 4 years on this planet. a little kid!) just to get her in a special stream at some gym? sometimes i just don't understand what people are thinking.

 

[gymgal]

I would have a conversation with the coach. Keep it lighthearted and tell her that your dd really enjoys the class but seems to be getting a little bored - it *is* her 3rd time through the class. Ask if there is a way to introduce a couple new things to her, like with the older girls. What you describe is pretty common with the older and younger girls in that age group getting the attn. Particularly if you have a quiet girl. Encourage her to speak up in class, asking for reassurance and more work. I had to do this with dd and it really helped her confidence to fend for herself. It also got her noticed whereas before she had just been a flower on the wall.

In general what you describe is pretty common to what we have in the US for rec prek classes but most gyms also have prek developmental classes where they pull girls who appear to have that early potential and run the class a little more like a pre-team where they focus a little more on skills. But I wouldn't worry about when you get back to the states. If she has a good attitude, loves to be in the gym, attends well and has some natural strength and flexibility, and shows some independence, that is what most gyms look for when placing kids in their developmental programs. Skills can be taught fairly easily when you have a child that exhibits all the above.

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[My_2_Gym_Monsters]

Why on earth would you try to do stretching and such things at home with a little kid (she's 4. 4 years on this planet. a little kid!) just to get her in a special stream at some gym? sometimes i just don't understand what people are thinking.

Because IMO the earlier she works on flexibility and some beginner skills the better. What I'm *thinking* is that she was obviously pulled from a rec class into advanced for a reason and that reason was not for her to continue on the same path playing around in class instead of actually beginning to develop herself.

Eta I'm not doing anything with her at home. We don't even have carpet in the house. She's already in the "special stream".

 

[My_2_Gym_Monsters]

I would have a conversation with the coach. Keep it lighthearted and tell her that your dd really enjoys the class but seems to be getting a little bored - it *is* her 3rd time through the class. Ask if there is a way to introduce a couple new things to her, like with the older girls. What you describe is pretty common with the older and younger girls in that age group getting the attn. Particularly if you have a quiet girl. Encourage her to speak up in class, asking for reassurance and more work. I had to do this with dd and it really helped her confidence to fend for herself. It also got her noticed whereas before she had just been a flower on the wall.

In general what you describe is pretty common to what we have in the US for rec prek classes but most gyms also have prek developmental classes where they pull girls who appear to have that early potential and run the class a little more like a pre-team where they focus a little more on skills. But I wouldn't worry about when you get back to the states. If she has a good attitude, loves to be in the gym, attends well and has some natural strength and flexibility, and shows some independence, that is what most gyms look for when placing kids in their developmental programs. Skills can be taught fairly easily when you have a child that exhibits all the above.

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She's certainly not the quiet one, but she has mastered the ability to take turns, be patient etc. I think part of my frustration is that this class Is supposed to be a developmental invitation only class. Over the past sessions it seems less developmental and more playing around. Which would be fine if she was actually progressing and learning something but it seems she is not.

 

[BlairBob]

Getting a kid under 7 to speak up? Hah, good luck on that.

How long is each class. I'd guess it's 55-60 minutes, maybe 75-90. With 55 minutes, there is only so much time to work on physical preparation. Well, besides not boring them to tears in the process.

Obstacle courses work well for 3yo, but I prefer to get away from them for 4yo only using them sparingly for a warmup as I generally use circuits per events when they are 4.

 

[My_2_Gym_Monsters]

Getting a kid under 7 to speak up? Hah, good luck on that.

How long is each class. I'd guess it's 55-60 minutes, maybe 75-90. With 55 minutes, there is only so much time to work on physical preparation. Well, besides not boring them to tears in the process.

Obstacle courses work well for 3yo, but I prefer to get away from them for 4yo only using them sparingly for a warmup as I generally use circuits per events when they are 4.

Two days a week, hour each class. They generally warm up on the long trampoline track (no clue what it's called) then move to an obstacle course on the floor. Then back to the long trampoline combined with a different obstacle. Next it's over to the regular trampoline. After that they work on the beams and then bars. Sometimes instead of doing beam they do yet another obstacle that ends with jumping in the pit. They did handstands on the floor as a group for the first time last week. Another frustration is that her class is the advanced kinder gym artistic class. They decided to do the same but for t&t which didn't work out as well as they hoped. They combined it with dd's class on Tuesday's and then the t&t class splits off and does a different day than her class. It's very confusing!

 

[gymcoach26]

We use obstacle courses for our 3 and 4 year olds- beginner preschool and advanced preschoolers. It is a "fun" way to develop their skills, but at least the courses we use have purpose behind the fun. Many parents ask this same question as you because they don't know the reasoning behind why we do what we do. They see it as only "playing" and not gymnastics. Maybe some of these examples will help clarify that something that looks like playing or messing around have a greater purpose. (I've been asked these just in the past week)

"Why are they goofing off on the mini trampoline jumping on and off the bar?" - They are learning to have straight arms in front support. They are learning to shift their grip on the bar. They are learning to cast and push away. They are gaining strength. All necessary if they are going to have any success in gymnastics

"Why does "Susie" keep putting her hands down on the trampoline? I thought you are supposed to jump on the trampoline"-- Susie is putting her hands down on the trampoline because that is what I have asked her to do. We are beginning to work on handstands and she is doing what we call donkey kicks, a precursor for handstands.

 

[My_2_Gym_Monsters]

We use obstacle courses for our 3 and 4 year olds- beginner preschool and advanced preschoolers. It is a "fun" way to develop their skills, but at least the courses we use have purpose behind the fun. Many parents ask this same question as you because they don't know the reasoning behind why we do what we do. They see it as only "playing" and not gymnastics. Maybe some of these examples will help clarify that something that looks like playing or messing around have a greater purpose. (I've been asked these just in the past week)

"Why are they goofing off on the mini trampoline jumping on and off the bar?" - They are learning to have straight arms in front support. They are learning to shift their grip on the bar. They are learning to cast and push away. They are gaining strength. All necessary if they are going to have any success in gymnastics

"Why does "Susie" keep putting her hands down on the trampoline? I thought you are supposed to jump on the trampoline"-- Susie is putting her hands down on the trampoline because that is what I have asked her to do. We are beginning to work on handstands and she is doing what we call donkey kicks, a precursor for handstands.

I get that I really do. What I am seeing is an overwhelmed coach with an assistant who is "in training" responsible for 8 3-5 yos. My dd flyS through the obstacles because no one is around to watch her.

 

[gymgal]

I think part of my frustration is that this class Is supposed to be a developmental invitation only class. Over the past sessions it seems less developmental and more playing around. Which would be fine if she was actually progressing and learning something but it seems she is not.

Oh - I misunderstood you. When you said advanced rec, I wasn't thinking it was in the developmental program. Where we are, we have several levels of rec (all of which are very fun oriented and less skill oriented) and then we have the developmental program which prepares the girls for true preteam. I would definitely talk to the coach then and express your concerns for your dd.

 

[emorymom]

I think there are a lot of reasons to want your child in a developmental stream rather than a play stream, even at 4. My 4 year old loved gym whether she was being given useful feedback for skill development or not. So I'd rather pay for more useful feedback and a longer class length so that I and her sibling could actually do something useful like go to the supermarket and come back rather than have to sit there because class is only 50 minutes.

In many gyms, I'm sure they miss a lot of great potential team kids, who love gym and would have parents who supported them being in team with the time and cost involved, because parents just sat around and said well, if she has what it takes I'm sure they'll pick her out of the rec classes.

If you're rec classes are great for developing talent, then I'm not talking about your gym. But this is a story that won't shock many: when my friend's daughter was about five, she liked gymnastics and wanted to pursue it. So her mother put her in rec and nothing much happened, though it was clear to me that her daughter's vestibular skills were great, and she was working on a great handstand and cartwheel just around the house, and had lots of passion. Child had more innate talent than my daughter, who was in a developmental track. Child was also well behaved so that's not the issue.

Child was doing 2 rec classes a week. I encouraged her to try to get her into the twice a week preteam at her gym. They evaluated her and told her she could join when she had a pullover. Well, over the next month her gymnastics classes literally never ... went ... to ... bars. My friend was frustrated. One class was taught by a man who had no gymnastics background. The other was taught by someone who was often on her cell phone. They did forward rolls down an inclined mat a lot. And lined up in a group of 10 and waited while one by one they jumped down the tumble track.

Of course her child never, ever got her pullover.

Mom went back and forth for a while on whether she wanted to gym shop but in the end just continued to sign up for rec and also got her daughter involved in easier to navigate activities and her daughter's interest drifted away from rec classes when she was seven or so.